Sorry guys, ignore that. I just read through the rest of the posts and I'm just repeating whats already been said!
Drift
- Thread starter someblokecalleddave
- Start date
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Ben, have you just come over from Youtube?
I have! found some really useful stuff here too. Its been so difficult to find any reliable information about drift. This really clears things up. I saw you direct someone else to this website so i decided to check it out myself. So good!
Drift is very mysterious, although seam angle plays a role, I find the slider (seam angle about 100 degrees) drifts quite a lot with consistency, I have no idea why.
I think the reason Warne got more drift than McGill was because Warne put more overspin on the ball, while McGill has after turn, so he put more sidespin on the ball.
I think the reason Warne got more drift than McGill was because Warne put more overspin on the ball, while McGill has after turn, so he put more sidespin on the ball.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Ben, if you can make sense of it in laymans terms and then put it into practice and bowl with or without drift alternate balls, I'd be most impressed and would love to hear exactly what it is that you do to get it to drift and then not drift!
Other than if there is a cross breeze, I really don't think its possible to bowl a ball that turns but doesn't drift.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
I also noticed that warne tended to have better seam than macgill in most of his deliveries. I reckon that could have added to it too
Im raring to try! But i must say that i rarely ever drift the ball. I always figured that if i slowed my delivery down, it would have more time to drift. After reading this however, i now realise that it actually has to be a bit faster to drift. Im confident with the amount of revs i put on the ball, but there's still definitely room for improvement. A bit of drift would be bloody useful in the t20 comp I'm in at the moment! haha.
Darth Spin
Active Member
I have no proof but I think my stock ball is drifting late when it dips. Is this possible? When I bowl well the seam is upright and slanted \\. The right handed batsman will follow the odd delivery as it drops, suggesting to me there is late movement in the air.
Highly probable if you are putting overspin on your deliveries.
Just to make it clear; let's say you bowled a ball that came out like a UFO (spinning parallel to the wicket) then it will start drifting straight away, if you bowled a ball like a normal delivery but with no over or under spin (spinning perpendicular to the wicket) then it will start drifting when it drops in the air.
Therefore bowling with a 'perfect' cricket ball:
- If you bowl a ball with sidespin and overspin it will start drifting only slightly straight away (UFO effect) then dip (overspin) and then drift when the ball starts to drop in the air (sidespin), common for legspinners
- If you bowl a ball with sidespin and underspin it will start drifting only slightly straight away (UFO effect), slight delay in dropping (underspin) and then get even more drift when the ball drops(sidespin), common for off-spinners
All of this depends on the state of the ball (ideally both sides haven't been banged up too much), getting the seam in a good position (scrambled seam kills drift) and getting decent revs on the ball.
Remember to not be confused on what you think you're seeing and think it through logically, I also suggest that you get a table tennis ball and see how different spin effects drift.
If anything I find that the ball drifts more with a scrambled seam - if I have a ball that is difficult to grip because it is damp or the seam has swollen up, then I will often grip it cross seam in order to get more purchase, and I find that it really bends like an inswinger.
Graeme Swann of course is famous for his drift, and he bowls with a scrambled seam more often than not.
Graeme Swann of course is famous for his drift, and he bowls with a scrambled seam more often than not.
Darth Spin
Active Member
Thanks for the detailed reply. I don't really understand the technical aspects of why a ball drifts but can appreciate why certain direction of spin makes it bend. I played table tennis at a stag do recently and all I was interested in was spin and drift. I've got another coming up soon also featuring a tennis table, there's also a t20 game lined up with me supplying the cricket gear, can't wait. I digress.
Anyway regarding my own deliveries I am happy with the angle of seam on my leg break, I definitely subscribe to the view that 45 degree (pointing around about 10 O'Clock/towards first/second slip) angle emphases drift, and this angle also brings dip and bounce into play more. I think it's the perfect delivery for the leg spinner to aim for and personally I am not fussed about bowling a big leg break with the seam angled more towards gully although maybe I should be. But I think I will remedy this by bowling more wrong uns and top spinners. My action just seems naturally predisposed to having more top spin than side when bowling the leg break. Well perhaps not necessarily more but an equal amount.
Swann uses the scrambled seam to inhibit drift, he varies the amount the seam is scrambled so he can vary his drift, Vettori does the same. If it was a case of cross-seam and then rip it to get drift we'd all be doing it rather than aiming for the 'perfect' seam position.
It's possible with the seam swelling up that the effect on the ball is different than in normal conditions, can't say that I've found any significant drift anytime I've bowled cross-seam with a water affected ball though.
I respectfully disagree. Using a scrambled seam to create a ball that drifts but does not turn is an age-old and widely used spin bowling tactic. See Warne here:
scrambled seam, definite drift.
With offspinners this technique has largely replaced the arm ball because its harder to pick but the ball is otherwise identical. Swann uses this delivery to get lots of lbw's against left handers with balls that drift in and then don't turn.
Of course, the way the seam is aligned on a baseball means it is always thrown with a scrambled seam, and baseball pitchers are able to create huge amounts of drift using sidespin.
See the wicked drift on this pitch here: http://wapc.mlb.com/play/?content_id=27171255 for an example
That's purely the magnus effect if I remember rightly, a slightly scrambled seam is fine but you still need a some airflow to touch on a smooth surface to maximise the effect. My guess is that we're interpreting each other as black and white here when if we met in person we'd probably find we're not actually far off in what we think is happening.
I managed to dig up this which has a pretty good diagram that summarises the basics on page 34:
http://vaughan.roberts.name/sites/default/files/Physics of bowling cricket balls - Part5.pdf
I managed to dig up this which has a pretty good diagram that summarises the basics on page 34:
http://vaughan.roberts.name/sites/default/files/Physics of bowling cricket balls - Part5.pdf
Drift is caused exclusively by the magnus effect - as opposed to swing which is not. Seam position and surface smoothness matters with swing bowling, with drift and swerve its purely to do with the angle of rotation and the number of revs.
(As a fascinating side note, actually surface smoothness can affect the Reynald's regime in more extremely examples, see for example the reverse magnus effect when a completely smooth flyaway football is hit with sidespin: kick it gently and it will bend one way, kick it harder and and suddenly it bends in the other direction. I'm not aware of any professional sport where this occurs. Perhaps this may account for the unusual results seen at lower velocities on page 33)
Dave! I finally managed to get out to the nets today and i DEFINITELY begun to create drift! It was interesting how i found it. I took five balls down and i'd just bowl them all, go and collect them and repeat etc. I experimented for while with no luck, so i just decided to start practising my different deliveries, so i bowled five leg breaks (no drift) then went and collected them, five sliders (no drift again), Then i bowled five top spinners. Now the very first toppy i bowled DEFINATELY drifted. It completely shocked me. I then just continued to bowl almost complete top spinners (seams maybe 11:30) and noticed the ball drifting quite consistently. These were the things i took note of for you:
1. When i bowled with more side spin, i didn't get any drift. Whether thats because the balls were delivered flatter and thus didn't get as much chance to dip and drift I'm not sure. Thats just the facts.
2. The drift was late, really only occurring when the ball was dipping, which would explain why the toppspinners produced more drift.
3. I pitched them up. To get drift, i really had to toss them up a little so they were landing quite full. too full. I reckon once i get more revs i'll be able to produce drift on a better length ball.
4. Not every single delivery drifted. It may have been because my seam position was poor but i couldn't see the seam anyway.
5. I used an old ball, and the conditions were damp. We had had a bit of rain earlier in the week.
Im so excited hahahaha