Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)

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macca said:
That's too bad. I went off that captain a bit when you posted they were not giving the protege a go until he got a bit more spin. That sounded like he was looking for excuses not to play him.
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The captain was right in that with his current bowling line up the protege needs to beat the bat with spin more often to fit in, he has a perfectly good left arm spinner to keep things tight and threaten the stumps every ball and so doesn't need a leggie that purely relies on accuracy. However, given the protege is carving up in reserve grade every time he brings his bowling boots and their batting is hardly electric I would've given him a shot as there's nothing to lose. The sad thing is that the best captain in the club is the reserve captain but he likes his beer too much to take the top job and will be going overseas soon.

Anyway, the protege will come back to reserves with a spinning track and 2 top first grade teams playing next door so if our club doesn't appreciate him I hope those other 2 clubs do.
 
leftie600 said:
Anyway, the protege will come back to reserves with a spinning track and 2 top first grade teams playing next door so if our club doesn't appreciate him I hope those other 2 clubs do.
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What do you mean by next door? You mean adjoining suburbs or that sort of thing? The tricky thing is signing up for the next season with his current club if he is unsure he has a secure spot in 1sts.
 
macca said:
What do you mean by next door? You mean adjoining suburbs or that sort of thing? The tricky thing is signing up for the next season with his current club if he is unsure he has a secure spot in 1sts.
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Ah, I mean on the ground beside the ground he is playing on this Saturday are the 2 top and richest sides in Wellington. If he takes another good batch of wickets there I'm hoping these clubs take notice and either give him a spot in one of their sides next season or scare our club into valuing him more than what he has been.
 
leftie600 said:
Ah, I mean on the ground beside the ground he is playing on this Saturday are the 2 top and richest sides in Wellington.
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Well they reckon Grimmett found it hard to get in the Wellington East firsts but when he got his chance he grabbed a stack of wickets and soon after got picked to represent Wellington Province as well.
 
It's been quiet for me in the last 2 weeks because I've damaged my shoulder. I'd be interested to get people's thoughts and opinions about shoulder injuries because I imagine there's some people here who have had them.

I need to do more conditioning and strengthening work it seems, when I'm recovered. There's possibly a rotator cuff strain, but I also think that I am sometimes trapping a tendon in the shoulder. I get a feeling of something being trapped in the shoulder. I had that for some time (maybe some months) where you could feel something click in and then out in the shoulder. It wasn't painful or even uncomfortable. But gradually I started to get a bit of pain in the front of the rotator cuff. Foolishly, I bowled for about 40mins in the nets and it's been quite sore since then (2 weeks ago). Now, when I get that feeling of the tendon trapping, it is a little bit more uncomfortable.

I've been wearing a shoulder support and resting it as much as possible. A few days ago I couldn't rotate my arm without pain. Thankfully, I can now rotate the arm slowly and without pain, but I'm probably a week or two away from being able to bowl again (maybe a month away from bowling flat out). For someone who bowled 4 or 5 days a week, it's really frustrating to not be able to bowl. I've only myself to blame.

It's clear I need to do more work, once the shoulder is recovered, on strengthening the muscles in the shoulder. I don't think I have a problem warming up. I always bowl well within myself for 10mins before pushing it. The problems came because I was bowling flat out and was also bowling some seam (might well give that a miss from now on as I only bowl it for the batter's benefit in the nets). I've never bothered with shoulder excercises and that's a big mistake. I've watched our club's pro do his shoulder exercises avidly. I've got to do the same.
 
Cleanprophet said:
It's been quiet for me in the last 2 weeks because I've damaged my shoulder. I'd be interested to get people's thoughts and opinions about shoulder injuries because I imagine there's some people here who have had them.

I need to do more conditioning and strengthening work it seems, when I'm recovered. There's possibly a rotator cuff strain, but I also think that I am sometimes trapping a tendon in the shoulder. I get a feeling of something being trapped in the shoulder. I had that for some time (maybe some months) where you could feel something click in and then out in the shoulder. It wasn't painful or even uncomfortable. But gradually I started to get a bit of pain in the front of the rotator cuff. Foolishly, I bowled for about 40mins in the nets and it's been quite sore since then (2 weeks ago). Now, when I get that feeling of the tendon trapping, it is a little bit more uncomfortable.

I've been wearing a shoulder support and resting it as much as possible. A few days ago I couldn't rotate my arm without pain. Thankfully, I can now rotate the arm slowly and without pain, but I'm probably a week or two away from being able to bowl again (maybe a month away from bowling flat out). For someone who bowled 4 or 5 days a week, it's really frustrating to not be able to bowl. I've only myself to blame.

It's clear I need to do more work, once the shoulder is recovered, on strengthening the muscles in the shoulder. I don't think I have a problem warming up. I always bowl well within myself for 10mins before pushing it. The problems came because I was bowling flat out and was also bowling some seam (might well give that a miss from now on as I only bowl it for the batter's benefit in the nets). I've never bothered with shoulder excercises and that's a big mistake. I've watched our club's pro do his shoulder exercises avidly. I've got to do the same.
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This is Liz's territory, if she looks in she'll give you some advice, but I know in the short term you need to stop bowling. If it is the rotator cuff, you have to be aware that if you go on to damage it to the point where it tears and cannot repair itself near on 100% you're then in trouble. If I remember rightly, Liz likened it to an elastic band - once it's been stretched so much it's never going to ever be as elastic as it should be. If they repair it once it's been torn, it's never anywhere near as elastic as it was and you lose a lot of the function of your shoulder. So in short stop bowling and let it rest.

There's a lot of info on youtube and explanations of the injury and then physio suggestions regarding coming back from injury and again there seems to be a body of opinion that suggests that this needs to be done correctly. Once back on track, you do need to work on your shoulder regularly in order to keep it in good nick. I'd be interested in hearing about what your pro player does prior to games and what he does to keep it working well.

In relation to me - being an old bloke I do a whole load of core strength work which is essential...

Planks in several different variations.
Press-ups in a number of different ways
I use exercise bands - sometimes.
Hand stands in the summer once I'm fit.
But the one I find most useful that resolved a problem I had 2 seasons ago is this exercise (2nd one down).

There's a few here that I use and would recommend once you're fit.. In fact I'll put them in order - in relation to recovery...




I really like this as well?


Hope this helps. It sounds as though you might have something different though - has anyone ever said that you're hyper-mobile have a look at this, there's some interesting stuff here and they mention clearly the connection between core strength and the overuse of the shoulder with no core strength...
"You can't fire a canon from a canoe".
http://experiencelife.com/article/shifty-shoulders/
 
Thanks for that Dave. Very good post indeed with plenty of very useful information. Some of those exercises look tough, but you can certainly see how they would build up a good core strength in the shoulder. The bloke in the 3rd video has a similar pyshique to me ;).

I'll certainly be doing a few of them once my shoulder allows it. That final article you put in there about firing a cannon from a canoe is probably on the money in my case. I am fairly certain where my problems stemmed from. Usually, I will do no upper body warm up before bowling in the nets. I'll just do a couple of mins warm up on my legs (groin and hamstrings). I do have quite decent shoulder strength naturally because I do have quite a strong build anyway and I've done lots of bowling over the years to build the muscles up to what I require. However, what I've done recently is bowl some seam for a batter before switching to legspin. This is where I am sure the problem came from. I'd try to bowl as quick as I can. Doing that without any shoulder warm ups was silly. In the past, I've started off bowling legspin and built into it, effectively warming the shoulder muscles up nicely before pushing it a bit more once I've bowled for 10mins-15mins. Bowling seam as quick as I can without any warm up is a certain way to risk shoulder injury. In the past, I've bowled seam as quick as I can after I'd bowled 30mins-40mins of legspin. At that point, my shoulder was well and truly warmed up. All the same, I'll give the seam bowling a miss from now on.

I was a bit ignorant about the shoulder before I had this problem. Since this injury, I read up on the rotator cuff and saw that a tear to a shoulder cuff muscle is bad news because it probably would need reconstructive surgery and there would be lesser strength for many people afterwards. I don't think I've torn my muscle because the pain wasn't too bad and there wasn't any inflammation or bruising/discolouration. It's been exactly 2 weeks since I last bowled and my shoulder is feeling a lot better today. I can now rotate the shoulder without any pain, but I will still wait at least another week before trying to rotate the arm with a bit more speed and possibly a couple of weeks before I try to bowl again (when I do bowl again, I'll bowl at 50% and well within myself).

The pro at my club uses a resistance trainer. He does lots of stretching (stretches himself into positions that make your eyes water). The main exercise he does (and he is a left arm finger spinner) is an overhead shoulder press with the resistance band/trainer. He attaches the handle to something about 4ft high (he uses the gate handle to the nets), stands with his back to it and pulls the band over his shoulder blade, straightening the arm.
 
Cleanprophet said:
Thanks for that Dave. Very good post indeed with plenty of very useful information. Some of those exercises look tough, but you can certainly see how they would build up a good core strength in the shoulder. The bloke in the 3rd video has a similar pyshique to me ;).

I'll certainly be doing a few of them once my shoulder allows it. That final article you put in there about firing a cannon from a canoe is probably on the money in my case. I am fairly certain where my problems stemmed from. Usually, I will do no upper body warm up before bowling in the nets. I'll just do a couple of mins warm up on my legs (groin and hamstrings). I do have quite decent shoulder strength naturally because I do have quite a strong build anyway and I've done lots of bowling over the years to build the muscles up to what I require. However, what I've done recently is bowl some seam for a batter before switching to legspin. This is where I am sure the problem came from. I'd try to bowl as quick as I can. Doing that without any shoulder warm ups was silly. In the past, I've started off bowling legspin and built into it, effectively warming the shoulder muscles up nicely before pushing it a bit more once I've bowled for 10mins-15mins. Bowling seam as quick as I can without any warm up is a certain way to risk shoulder injury. In the past, I've bowled seam as quick as I can after I'd bowled 30mins-40mins of legspin. At that point, my shoulder was well and truly warmed up. All the same, I'll give the seam bowling a miss from now on.

I was a bit ignorant about the shoulder before I had this problem. Since this injury, I read up on the rotator cuff and saw that a tear to a shoulder cuff muscle is bad news because it probably would need reconstructive surgery and there would be lesser strength for many people afterwards. I don't think I've torn my muscle because the pain wasn't too bad and there wasn't any inflammation or bruising/discolouration. It's been exactly 2 weeks since I last bowled and my shoulder is feeling a lot better today. I can now rotate the shoulder without any pain, but I will still wait at least another week before trying to rotate the arm with a bit more speed and possibly a couple of weeks before I try to bowl again (when I do bowl again, I'll bowl at 50% and well within myself).

The pro at my club uses a resistance trainer. He does lots of stretching (stretches himself into positions that make your eyes water). The main exercise he does (and he is a left arm finger spinner) is an overhead shoulder press with the resistance band/trainer. He attaches the handle to something about 4ft high (he uses the gate handle to the nets), stands with his back to it and pulls the band over his shoulder blade, straightening the arm.
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Yeah none of them are easy - the series of exercises in the 5 minute workout I've modified and do alongside a cardio work-out. It kills me! I try and do it every other night to allow myself to recover and in the in between night I try and go for a 20 minute run or a power-walk as it's not that bad on the knees. If I run I do this thing that I picked up from David Hinchcliffe. I use the lamp posts along the road. I power walk the distance between 2 lamp posts and then sprint one as fast as I can - it makes it more cricket specific. You never continuously run in cricket, you spend ages in between balls and then have to sprint, so the training I do when running kind of emulates that scenario.
 
Hi Cleanprophet,

Could you be a little more specific about where in the shoulder you feel the pain?

Also, stand straight with your arms to your side.
Slowly raise your straight arms outwards about 35 degrees - return.
Slowly raise your straight arms forwards about 35 degrees - return.

Stand with your arms outstretched in front of you, keeping them parallel, palms facing.
Slowly move both arms outwards until they form a cross with your trunk.
Slowly move them back to parallel.

Which movement causes the most pain?
 
Liz Ward said:
Hi Cleanprophet,

Could you be a little more specific about where in the shoulder you feel the pain?

Also, stand straight with your arms to your side.
Slowly raise your straight arms outwards about 35 degrees - return.
Slowly raise your straight arms forwards about 35 degrees - return.

Stand with your arms outstretched in front of you, keeping them parallel, palms facing.
Slowly move both arms outwards until they form a cross with your trunk.
Slowly move them back to parallel.

Which movement causes the most pain?
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Hi Liz,

The first set cause a little bit of discomfort. The second set cause no pain or discomfort at all.

The area of pain is right around the deltoid/subscapularis tendon area. The arm movement that causes the most discomfort is when I straighten my arm behind me and move the arm up into a vertical position. Moving the arm outwards from my side causes a little bit of pain, but it's very mild. I can now rotate my arm without much pain at all (it's been 15 days since it was at its worst and I've rested it completely since then, using pain relief gels, a heat pad and, in the last week, a shoulder support).

There is that one other aspect which is that feeling of a nerve or tendon being trapped. Sometimes I will get that feeling that a nerve or tendon is being pinched a little. If I move my arm/shoulder about a bit, it goes away. It was at its worst about week ago at night. Lying on my left-hand side I would get that feeling in my right shoulder and it would take a bit of manouvering around of the shoulder for that discomfort to go. Incidently, I discovered that lifting my arm up so that I could put my hand behind my head always fixed the problem.
 
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Sorry Cleanprophet, when you say, '...deltoid/subscapularis tendon area', I am not too clear where you mean. Are you talking about the top of the arm?

Which deltoid do you mean; anterior, lateral or posterior?

Take a look at the illustration here [http://www.pitchvision.com/how-to-protect-your-shoulder-from-cricket-injury/] and try to be more specific. For instance, 'along the top of the shoulder about an inch in from the arm' etc. If you eliminate the second set of activities it would eliminate subscapularis.

Could you provide an illustration for '...straighten my arm behind me and move the arm up into a vertical position.' I am not really sure how you are doing this.

It sounds very much as if you are not engaging your shoulder stabilisers. If this is the case, I am afraid the pain will return when you return to bowling.
 
Liz Ward said:
Sorry Cleanprophet, when you say, '...deltoid/subscapularis tendon area', I am not too clear where you mean. Are you talking about the top of the arm?

Which deltoid do you mean; anterior, lateral or posterior?

Take a look at the illustration here [http://www.pitchvision.com/how-to-protect-your-shoulder-from-cricket-injury/] and try to be more specific. For instance, 'along the top of the shoulder about an inch in from the arm' etc. If you eliminate the second set of activities it would eliminate subscapularis.

Could you provide an illustration for '...straighten my arm behind me and move the arm up into a vertical position.' I am not really sure how you are doing this.

It sounds very much as if you are not engaging your shoulder stabilisers. If this is the case, I am afraid the pain will return when you return to bowling.
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It is very much in the anterior deltoid area. I spotted this web page about a tear in the subscapularis tendon. In the picture, the sonogram image is being taken in the exact area where I have some discomfort:

http://www.med.umich.edu/rad/muscskel/mskus/images/226/226.html

When I mentioned the action of having my arm behind me. It is, effectively, as if I am trying to bowl a cricket ball overarm. The discomfort starts once my arm is in the take back position, with my arm outstretched behind me. The pain starts once my arm is lifted to shoulder height and continues as I lift my arm up into a vertical position. Once my arm then comes back down into a position of being outstretched in front of me, the pain stops.

I don't know very much at all about the shoulder stabilisers or how or why they would not be engaged when bowling and if that is the problem, what the solution would be?
 
Ah! I am with you now Cleanprophet!

Just one more question - is the pain on the edge of your torso or actually on the edge of your arm [the ball at the top of the arm bone of the ball and socket joint]. I know it is difficult to feel sometimes as we are only talking less than a centimetre difference but it is important.
 
Liz Ward said:
Ah! I am with you now Cleanprophet!

Just one more question - is the pain on the edge of your torso or actually on the edge of your arm [the ball at the top of the arm bone of the ball and socket joint]. I know it is difficult to feel sometimes as we are only talking less than a centimetre difference but it is important.
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That's right. It is exactly where you say (the ball at the top of the arm bone). Right where the ball of humerus enters the socket.

I hope it isn't an issue with the shoulder stabilisers because that sounds like a long term problem. Wouldn't a failure to engage the shoulder stabilisers cause pain to most movement of the shoulder rather this specific movement problem that I have?

As I said in an earlier post, there has never been any bruising or inflammation. I know you do still see some tears of muscles without discolouration/inflammation, but I took it as a positive sign that this didn't happen for me and that the pain was not that bad, just more uncomfortable than anything else.
 
I would not worry too much Cleanprophet... it is not serious. You have definitely 'pulled' a muscle but it will heal quite quickly; it sounds very much like a Grade 1 injury.

If you are not engaging your shoulder stabilisers it just means you are asking the RCs to stabilise as well as mobilise and they are not designed to do that.

However, your symptoms are still not clear. It is unlikely to be the subscapularis... you eliminated any issue there with your answers above and [almost] everything identifies the pec minor insertion... but not quite everything!

Whichever it is, it will heal but unfortunately I cannot say for definite without seeing you. If you have another soft tissue specialist near you, they could tell you in an instant.

The door frame stretch here http://www.wikihow.com/Perform-Chest-Stretches will help but take it easy and do not do it to pain. Gently increase range of movement as the discomfort improves.
 
Liz Ward said:
The door frame stretch here http://www.wikihow.com/Perform-Chest-Stretches will help but take it easy and do not do it to pain. Gently increase range of movement as the discomfort improves.
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Thanks very much for your help. I understand it is pretty much impossible to diagnose the problem without a physical examination. Not that I know a great deal about such things, but I always felt that it was nothing more serious than a strain (grade 1, as you say). But I'm no expert, so it's good to get an opinion from someone who knows about these things.

It's been just about 2 weeks since I last bowled a ball. It was a little tender before I bowled, so it was silly of me to not rest it when it was telling me to rest it for a few days. It is getting better, which is the main thing. Some exercises are a good idea because I don't want to allow the other muscles weaken too much. Based upon how it has healed so far, I would guess that another 1-2 weeks should see the injury clear up.

I've certainly learned my lesson about warming up properly and taking good care of my bowling shoulder.

Once again, thanks for your help. I'll post back here later in the week and update on how the shoulder is feeling.
 
Absolutely right Cleanprophet, it is always best to get advice.

For a Grade 1 strain, I would always consider approximately 3 week rest. This does not, of course, mean no mobility and it is a good idea to keep it 'rolling' over with as full a range of motion as you can muster without pain.

The body is extremely good at telling us what we need to know and we ignore it at our peril! :D

Warming up is essential but if the issue returns it may be mechanical. If so, let me have a video and I will have a look.

Take care!
 
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