Pivot, Use Of Ring Finger

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tcs

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I have been bowling this year, free of back pain, mostly in the nets.
Couple of areas I need some help and welcome all comments.
1.
I am not getting completely side-on - you can see it in these videos:




At this point, I am thinking I am too heavy to turn the body around :)
Any drills to get side on?

2.
I remember getting my ring finger ripped bowling legspin in my school days.
But I seem to be using the wrist more these days and I am not getting the rip
out of the fingers.
 


Dear tcs


Trying to analyse ur vids in kinovea software though the clips are small enough to comment


Frankly speaking U have nice & smooth action overall…but as u hv recognized already few technical issues need to be addressed for further betterment. I am trying to attach few images to substantiate the finding….


  1. Front foot should be pointed towards gully/thirdman direction of a Lt handed batsman (image 01)
  2. Early droping of front shoulder (image 01)
  3. Hip rotation at the end needs to be more purposeful (Image 02 )
  4. Pivot rotation is negligible which inturns hampering hip rotation (image 3-7 series)
  5. Thrust of back leg is not optimum after pivoting (images 06_feet).
I hope these will answer ur quaries....:)


View attachment 162 Pivot-back-036.jpg Pivot-back-046.jpg Pivot-feet_key emages-31.jpg Pivot-feet_key emages-34.jpg Pivot-feet_key emages-39.jpg Pivot-feet_key emages-42.jpg Pivot-feet_key emages-45.jpg
 
Hi TCS Good to see you back here. Hows cricket going in the U S of A?
I find myself lapsing into the same problem as you now and again. I have a weak back leg as high esteem has pointed out with you too. I really struggle with it but I have found I can get some compensation with a really strong leading arm. It seems when your front leg lands it stops your forward momentum and pivoting properly.
 
When I bowl I consiously use my leading arm to really pull my body forward to get over the front leg. Starting with the arm high and getting it to draw the biggest radius I can with it, then as the arm comes down and starts to go backwards I get it to pull against the braced front leg and then the knee straightens when I have got my weight forward enough.
Sorry its a bit confusing to explain but it helps me a lot and gets me pivoting properly.
 
chippyben said:
Your action looks very easy and natural though. I think you get side on ok I couldnt pick what you meant by that.
Click to expand...

Not sure my right foot is always parallel to the crease - the first video is my foot lands most of the time.
Whatever I try, my left foot seems to rotate to off side during landing - is this due to my body rotating
too early?
 
Thanks hiesteem - these are good observations.

What should the position of my left shoulder/arm should be at your snapshot #1?.

I have tried to land my left foot facing fine leg, it still rotates and lands either straight down the wicket or
facing slips. I am wondering if my body is rotating towards off side already and the leg goes with it.
 
tcs said:
Thanks hiesteem - these are good observations.

What should the position of my left shoulder/arm should be at your snapshot #1?.

I have tried to land my left foot facing fine leg, it still rotates and lands either straight down the wicket or
facing slips. I am wondering if my body is rotating towards off side already and the leg goes with it.
Click to expand...

@tcs
Before discussing the positioning of Left shoulder my observation regarding this is that ur centre of Gravity line from head to heel has been disturbed due to lordotic spine position (hyperextension of Spine !!) see ss#1 (may be due to back pain which u talked earlier.... @Liz can comment more on this).
Another issue is u r not looking at the batsman with straight neck rather head is dropping towards Lt side. these 2 reasons may
further pushing ur shoulder to open position. these shoulder /head position may be becoz of ur open pivot position of Lt foot vice versa.I mean as pivoting is negligible it is not pushing ur rt foot further n shoulder follow thru from batsman direction to back is not forceful.
In nutsheel shoulder, head, pivoting foot n hip rotation are so much interlinked n dependent to each other that leggies sometime feel frustrated to make all these dynamics syncronised correctly.

I think I am clear to u SOME HOW ;)
 
tcs said:
At this point, I am thinking I am too heavy to turn the body around :)
Any drills to get side on?
Click to expand...

I hear lots of complaints about this. Even young guys who wonder where their leg drive is? Perhaps concentrating on one aspect of the final position and trying to get to that position -- could be helpful.

One position I think of is getting that right hip almost over the left leg. Problem is -- can you get there without being injured? If you can achieve that then getting side-on would come easily.
 
pretty much the entire bottom row. Look at that back hip -- almost a straight line from left leg to the knee up to the right hip. Now that's getting up and through the delivery stride!

It's actually amazing seeing that series of images -- his right hip so attuned to the position of that front knee. nice!
 
Just from watching the video quickly (not a heap of time so i apologise if some things here are being repeated) your head position is causing your body weight to call towards left of screen when you hit the crease....your left shoulder drops (get your shoulders more parallel with the ground) as you pull down, losing momentum and the rotation you speak of.
Now... the interesting part I THINK from this is, you know what you are doing wrong as far as lack of rotation goes, therefore you are consciously trying to get rotation into your action... however it looks as though you are doing it slightly the wrong way by pushing your back hip through a little and opening your front leg due to this... rather than pulling through with your leading arm and getting up and over your front leg.
My suggestion would be to start at the crease with your feet in the correct position, and use your front arm to pull down and get some rotation of the hips going... bowling the ball from a standing start. Get this right and then slowly build back into your full run up.
I think if you get your front arm and the timing of your rotation with this right, as well as getting your body more upright at the crease... the rest should follow.
 
doctortran said:
pretty much the entire bottom row. Look at that back hip -- almost a straight line from left leg to the knee up to the right hip. Now that's getting up and through the delivery stride!

It's actually amazing seeing that series of images -- his right hip so attuned to the position of that front knee. nice!
Click to expand...

I think Macca encourages this by suggesting that your foot hits your buttocks at this stage (Bottom row)?
 
Andrew Bourne said:
My suggestion would be to start at the crease with your feet in the correct position, and use your front arm to pull down and get some rotation of the hips going... bowling the ball from a standing start. Get this right and then slowly build back into your full run up.
I think if you get your front arm and the timing of your rotation with this right, as well as getting your body more upright at the crease... the rest should follow.
Click to expand...

*likes*
 
Regarding your ring finger, have you thought about using your second (middle finger) to spin the ball rather than the third one? I use this grip and can still the ball a good rip.
 
tcs said:
I have been bowling this year, free of back pain, mostly in the nets.
Couple of areas I need some help and welcome all comments.
1.
I am not getting completely side-on - you can see it in these videos:




At this point, I am thinking I am too heavy to turn the body around :)
Any drills to get side on?

2.
I remember getting my ring finger ripped bowling legspin in my school days.
But I seem to be using the wrist more these days and I am not getting the rip
out of the fingers.
Click to expand...



With the amount of revs you seem to be getting, how can any of those things matter?:D... Looks like your getting a good deal of drift and dip, as well as turn. I'm no expert on how to fix actions so I can't help you with that, sorry:(

It's no good using ONLY the wrist, the wrist should be used to provide most of the spring power and explosive momentum yes, but your ring finger is the icing on the cake. The more wrist you use in conjunction with the ring finger, the more revs. Using just the wrist is the way that batsmen and wicket keepers bowl leg spin to impress their mates. You seem to get enough spin this way (if there is such a thing as "enough" spin) but I would advise you to start using the ring finger again. The middle knuckle of the ring finger (which allows it to bend and straighten) should be on the seam, and I prefer to have the last knuckle off the seam so that it's contact with the seam is delayed - more revs. My ring finger is heavily callused on the middle knuckle, the last knuckle, and between the middle and ring fingers.

That's the method most wrist spinners use, including the person that scarred Mike Gatting for life.
 
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