The Samit Patel Files

someblokecalleddave

Well-Known Member
The Samit Patel Files

Samit Patel hungry to lose weight | England Cricket News | Cricinfo.com

I liked Samit Patels bowling last year and wondered where he'd got to and it seems he's the bloke that ate all the pies and if you search around you'll find a handful of articles about his desire to be back in the team. The Times newspaper seems to have an interest in him and today there's an article in the paper where he saying he's trying to get his act together so that he gets another shout at playing for England again. The only thing is the bloke seems to be ridiculously ignorant of what he needs to do for instance in the Times article today written by John Westerby Patels is quoted as saying.....

"Crisps have been my downfall....... Walkers, any flavour.... I've said that I'm allowed two packets a week and now I'm going to stick to that".

I think that says it all.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

But if you read the whole article and I've read others he sounds incredibly naiive about food and nutrition and you'd have expected at this level with such an amazing opportunity giving up on crisps would be such an easy thing to do - I mean it's to represent your country for God sakes!!! It's likely that the crisp thing is just the tip of the iceberg. The article talks about the fact that he lives at home with his parents and the inference is that their cooking is doing him no favours either. It seems ridiculous that a bloke who is under the guidance of the nutritionists and fitness instructors at county and national level with this opportunity would even have a bag of crisps in his house - it shouldn't even be in his vocabluary surely?

He needs to have a word with David Hinchcliffe or sign up to one these forums!!!
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

People and their relationship with food can be complex. No matter what professional help is around some people will still eat the wrong foods.

Maybe harder for him living with his parents than if he was in his own house. I guess that up until recently he was locked into a cycle of eating whatever was prepared for him and having little say in the matter. Of course, that doesn't excuse gorging on crisps.

If he lived in his own house, he'd at least have a chance to break that cycle and introduce a healthier regime. However, it sounds like he's one of those people that are naturally 'bigger', meaning he has to be careful and work extra hard at it. Again not an excuse but it can take time to understand your body and there is nothing to say that he still wouldn't look big on a diet of salad etc.

Did you come across any reference to what his fitness scores were as that would make interesting reading.

He's not the first one to turn up overweight and he won't be the last. It sounds like the message is starting to sink in but always the proof is in the pudding and he'll be judged on his fitness and weight as well as performances next season.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

It seems last year Pieterson kicked him out of the England set-up and slammed him publicly for being unfit and over-weight with an attack that made the press. Which in PC terms was pretty nasty and seems to have initially knocked him for six. Patel then said that he'd work on it and that he was determined to make a come back, but reading between the lines, the psycological effect on him was such that his attempts to get back on track were undermined and failed to up his game to the point where he was going nowhere with his fitness and weight. He then had to have a review with England to see how he was going fairly recently and again he failed. It seems this time the approach hasn't been quite so Pieterson-esque in it's evaluation of his situation and the recent article seems to have been written in a way that he's got more control over and it seems to be more positive. Although there still seems to be an essence of the paper ridiculing the 'Fat Lad' in his attempts to get back into the England squad, which I suppose if I'm honest I'm party to in this thread.

But a part of me would like to see the bloke succeed, as you've said it's a complex issue. At my age it would be exceptionally easy for me to put weight on, I only have to start drinking lager for instance in very small amounts and I'd begin to put weight on. I look around at people I work with for instance who are over-weight and moan about it and don't like the fact that they are, but then I see them using the lift, tucking away the pies, crisps and coca-cola and think 'Why'? Obviously it's not that easy for them as is the case with Patel, but as I said earlier the fact that you're faced with the opportunity to play for England surely that would be the encouragement.

To your question, no I've not come across the details of his fitness levels.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

This is a really interesting subject Dave. I do not know the facts regarding Samit Patel's issues so forgive me if I 'talk' generally.

I have worked with 'talented' players who have not needed to do too much to be the big fish in a small pond so when they have to give that little extra, they have no idea how to.

I am sure you have heard of the horse that you can lead to water...

It is the same with athletes. They may have PTs and nutritionists but we can only do so much. I have worked with players who, when with me, appear so focussed, they want to make it and will do anything to do so. When they are with me, they put in 110%. Unfortunately, I cannot live with them and often find that in the time we have been apart, despite having a fitness programme written down for them and even a list of meals and snacks, they have not adhered to any.

I really do think that these people believe that by just having a PT, nutritionist etc, their work is done. They will get in to shape by association :)

Most of the guys I work with, need to put on weight [meat not fat] and that is far harder, losing weight is easy compared and as you say, getting and keeping fit is easy if you don't always take the easy options; lifts, cars etc.

When you work with athletes, who you know have the potential to go all the way, and they tell you that they want to go all the way, but do not do anything they need to, relying on their talent [which is not infinite], you can really lose your patience. This may explain Pieterson's actions.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

From the highlights I saw of the matches he was involved in he was a good bowler and by all accounts good with the bat too and gave England that added perspective of an all-rounder as mentioned in some of the articles about him. Unlike Rashid who again I've only seen highlights of Samit looked confident on the big stage and far more like the finished article. So yes - you're probably right from anyone who's role it is to ensure they get the most out of a player it must be incredibly frustrating that when all is required is something so simple as modifying your diet mariginally and then acting like a sportsman e.g. training and it's seemingly ignored.

I'm scratching my head trying to think about a situation in life where I've known someone to be in a similar situation that looks easy to address and yet they don't. All of the incidences I can think of come down to mental fragility - whereby on a really basic level the person involved was just insecure about some aspect of their lives that then led them to have a weakness with regards their development in some way. I think lots of us have these issues whereby we're afraid of going forward because we lack the self belief, we might go so far and that might be within the limits of our comfort zone. But when faced with someone then saying yes you can go to another zone all you have to do is A and B you then stall maybe because perhaps you see the other zone as being somewhere you may expose yourself in some way that you feel you can't cope with? Maybe Patel reached the England team through some gradual process that was slow and relatively easy and it kind of fell in his lap. Having got there though someone like Pieterson has then said now you have to step up a gear cos you're here with the big boys now and as well as being naturally good you're an athelete and there are expectations and standards.

It maybe that the situation he is in suits him, he plays county cricket he's been to the top once or twice, perhaps what he gets paid is enough and he's happy to be where he is and doesn't really want to be flying all around the world away from his Mum's cooking. Maybe he's just flirting with the idea and has no real conviction or belief in his own mental strength to play for England?

Puttting a wrist spin spin on it in Peter Philpotts book 'The Art of Wrist Spin Bowling' he makes this very point, he says that there are people he's known that are excellent bowlers but in order to make it to 1st class cricket and represent your country - that's a whole other animal and one that has a whole different set of attributes and one of the key attributes is the mental strength and total focus aspect that Samit in the Times article reveals he hasn't actually got.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

At least it's just crisps and not Cocaine or prostitutes or something of that ilk. Some people have addictive personalities and it's not as easy as just giving it up, regardless of how beneficial it could be. England isn't exactly the best place for maintaining a diet either, just look at Mark Cosgrove's experience! It seems pretty unlikely that he is adhering to a proper fitness training plan though. If he's running or working out every day then a few crisps here and there aren't going to be the difference between being a swimsuit model or a butterball.

He may be in need of some professional counselling, or at least some honest words from his coach/fitness advisor at Notts, because it looks like it all comes down to poor work ethic and self-restraint (armchair psychologist :p).
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

someblokecalleddave;376303 said:
You'll have to fill us in on the 'Mark Cosgrove Experience'.

mmmm, I was wondering that too. I find England the very best place to maintain any diet one wishes...
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

All i know about mark cosgrove is that he was an aussie "prodigy" but was massivly too fat,,, and his philosophy on cricket is "if your good enough your thin enough" i'm sure he said that.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

Forgive me,

Mark Cosgrove was a South Australian cricketer who had been earmarked as the next big thing, having a few year ago scored the most runs in the sheffield shield (IIRC) and played a few ODI's for Australia, acquitting himself very well. Despite this, he was hugely overweight for a professional athlete, and was told to work on his weight over the off-season, in which he would be playing county cricket for Glamorgan. He came back even fatter than before, and consequently was dropped from the state squad for most of the season. He's now back playing for the Redbacks, but has yet to reach the lofty heights of 2005/06, and playing for Australia again seems unlikely.

The comment about England being a poor place for a diet may have been a little rash, it was based on Cosgrove as well as a few mates of mine who have gone over to play club cricket in England for a season, and despite playing 2-3 times a week, stacked on the weight, citing the 'English cuisine' of curries, chips & gravy and beer as the main culprits. Still that may be due to the fact that they, along with Cosgrove, were in extended 'party-mode' for their stay, and not because of some over-abundance of fatty foods available to them.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

a for effort;376334 said:
The comment about England being a poor place for a diet may have been a little rash, it was based on Cosgrove as well as a few mates of mine who have gone over to play club cricket in England for a season, and despite playing 2-3 times a week, stacked on the weight, citing the 'English cuisine' of curries, chips & gravy and beer as the main culprits. Still that may be due to the fact that they, along with Cosgrove, were in extended 'party-mode' for their stay, and not because of some over-abundance of fatty foods available to them.

Ah! I see!

Funny enough, this is exactly what I was talking about. It is always someone/something elses fault. Here it is the fault of the curries etc, not the fault of the person eating them... just as it is the fault of the crisps. Strangely enough, we are not all overweight over here, hence most of my work is in increasing mass, could it really be that this food, mentioned above, is not available to all of us? I think it is more that some of us know when to say 'no' and 'no more'. A little of everything is good for you and it is great to be able to get everything over here but if you insist on eating 'everything'... ...best not to get me on to the subject of beer :)
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

a for effort;376334 said:
The comment about England being a poor place for a diet may have been a little rash, it was based on Cosgrove as well as a few mates of mine who have gone over to play club cricket in England for a season, and despite playing 2-3 times a week, stacked on the weight, citing the 'English cuisine' of curries, chips & gravy and beer as the main culprits. Still that may be due to the fact that they, along with Cosgrove, were in extended 'party-mode' for their stay, and not because of some over-abundance of fatty foods available to them.

The culture is like that to some extent for the Aussie players. Most of them tend to get paid by the club and have little to do in the week outside of a few hours coaching. All to easy to go out 3/4 times a week and pig out. As you say, its party time.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

The food in the UK isn't the issue it's just food and there's plenty of it in all sorts of forms ranging from utter filth/junk to the best food in the world. It's the choices that you make about what food you eat that make a difference and the good food message has been around all my life and I'm 49. That same message in the last 20 years has got stronger and clearer as the forms of communication have improved so how anyone can have missed the point is beyond me unless of course you switch over the news and documentaries and food programs and choose to watch East Enders, X-Factor and all that kind of dross.

But there are class, cultural and economic factors to consider, but surely just by virtue of taking sport seriously you're going to overcome some of the deficits in knowledge around the food subject? Just by wanting to play your sport at a more serious level you're soon going to have to look at the way you eat in order to maximise your fitness and stamina potential? This is why I find the Samit story so incredible?
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

I don't know if it is all that strange to be honest Dave. Cricket is not a sport that demands high levels of stamina, by the by. Patel is primarily a batsman who bowls spin/slow stuff - how much power/dynamism/stamina does he need?

Ok, batting for long periods can be tiring but a large part of that is the mental element, the rest down to running between the wickets. Even then, it's reasonably slow paced with regular breaks and a chance to control the pace if you need to.

Look at how many 'big blokes' have played the game to a high level over the years, from Grace to Rob Key. The truth is that up until very recently you could get away with carrying a bit.
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

Yeah I suppose you've got a point, I read somewhere in one of the articles that despite Samits size he's a good and enthusiastic fielder and I suppose even if he was massive which he's not (like Dwayne Leverock - Bermuda) he could field in the slips?

I wonder what Pietersons gripe was with him then? As you're kind of suggesting he could be accommodated within the side if you just played to his strengths? But then would that set up a scenario where the others who do have to run around a lot more when they're fielding and therefore train harder get a bit miffed when Samit's taking it easy because his niche in the team negates the need to be as fit as them?
 
Re: The Samit Patel Files

If he came into the team and averaged 50 with the bat and 33 with the ball then no-one would question his weight. He would be seen to be contributing and that would be that.

I guess what I'm saying is that there are some people who can be accommodated (because of size or temperament etc) but only if they bring something to the team that others can't. In the case of Patel there are others out there who can do a similar job.

As for KP, who knows. Maybe he sees someone who is not making the most of their potential, maybe he's just an arse. I suspect that KP wanted to run a tight ship with everyone under his control. Patel turning up overweight was in effect saying that he could and would do whatever he wanted, undermining KP.
 
Samits in the one day match today and he may get a bat, I hope he does, as Pieterson is playing poorly at the minute and it would be nice to see Samit get in there and put some runs on the board against Pakistans spinners. It'll be good to see him take some wickets later with his bowling. We'll get to see if he looks as if he's still tucking away the pies as well!
 
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