The Flipper And It's Variations

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someblokecalleddave

someblokecalleddave

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I thought I'd start a Flipper thread as I've just been reading Brian Wilkins and I'm amazed at how much he covers this delivery and the depth of the research involved, it's opened up a whole new world to me that goes way beyond Grimmett! I've been so inspired by the information I'm now looking to re-visit the delivery again and maybe re-instate my Back-Spinning variation as a part of my repetoire for this season.
 
Blimey! Wilkins does say...
"
Even now, more than 30 years later (after Peter May dismissal), I’m prepared to lay a tidy bet that not one cricketer or cricket watcher in ten thousand understands what a Flipper really is. Not that there are plenty, including media commentators who think they know.
Brian Wilkins, The Bowlers Art, A&C Black, London, 1991

Looking at the response to this thread it does look as though this does seem to be true! Anyone out there bowling a flipper, or practicing with it at least? How are you bowling it - how do you hold your wrist, is the ball seam up, or do you bowl the Benaud version with the flying saucer seam action?
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Blimey! Wilkins does say...
"
Even now, more than 30 years later (after Peter May dismissal), I’m prepared to lay a tidy bet that not one cricketer or cricket watcher in ten thousand understands what a Flipper really is. Not that there are plenty, including media commentators who think they know.
Brian Wilkins, The Bowlers Art, A&C Black, London, 1991

Looking at the response to this thread it does look as though this does seem to be true! Anyone out there bowling a flipper, or practicing with it at least? How are you bowling it - how do you hold your wrist, is the ball seam up, or do you bowl the Benaud version with the flying saucer seam action?
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I always tried to do the Benaud version, but it's *really* hard, so now I'm trying it the easy way (backspin) when I practise. It does seem to work when I pitch it but I'm still at the 'it might fly out anywhere' stage.

I don't think one needs to be too fussy about having a perfectly straight seam all the way though, if you are propelling the ball with the click I think the ball will naturally want to come out as backspin however you start off.

I've been occasionally pitching the 'wrong wrong'un' (thumbspun from back of hand - thanks Dave!) which I think counts as a flipper variation.
 
boogiespinner said:
I always tried to do the Benaud version, but it's *really* hard, so now I'm trying it the easy way (backspin) when I practise. It does seem to work when I pitch it but I'm still at the 'it might fly out anywhere' stage.

I don't think one needs to be too fussy about having a perfectly straight seam all the way though, if you are propelling the ball with the click I think the ball will naturally want to come out as backspin however you start off.

I've been occasionally pitching the 'wrong wrong'un' (thumbspun from back of hand - thanks Dave!) which I think counts as a flipper variation.
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Oh, that's good. The thing I've realised is that you shouldn't focus on any of the deliveries that you see on the inter-webs or read about in books initially, or get at all hung up on whether the seam comes out one way or another. The main thing is to get the actual click action going so that it imparts spin and then turn your arm over with the click action. Then at that stage just see and what feels or looks affective when you perform the click in your bowling action. I reckon if you just go with what feels comfortable and if it seems to work it's going to be valid as it wont be your stock ball. So in getting that far - no matter what way the seam rotates, that's if you spin it round the seam (Cross seam will work as well) the ball is going to be a flipper and will be different to your stock ball. You'd have done it! You'll be one of those rare ones that bowls a flipper.

I've pruned my bowling this year down to bowling just leg-breaks in 3 ways...

(1). My stock ball, which is intended to be a 45 degree style ball and seems to be.
(2). One with a lot more over-spin and less side-spin (often turns more for some reason)
(3). One which is supposed to be side spin (90 degrees) which hardly ever bites and goes straight on - I guess what you might call a 'Slider'?

The only variation which I try vary rarely is the back-spinning flipper and your out the back of the hand one, which comes out with seam pointed almost at 45 towards slips area, but with back-spin. I need to practice more with either one of them over the winter ready for next season.
 
I've always thought of a flipper as a delivery where you give the ball an offspinners twist (clockwise) but the wrist is in the same position as you would have for a standard 45 degree leg break. The result of this is that the ball has a little bit of backspin and offspin with the key being that it doesn't behave like a legbreak but looks like a legbreak at delivery to an unobservant batsman.

All these other flipper variations are take the offspin twist all the way through the 360 degree loop (makes it sound so easy!).

Always fun to have a go at the different variations and I remember mucking around with the 'flipper googly' as a kid, bloody difficult to bowl and I don't think my shoulder would've lasted this long if I'd mastered it. My bloody younger brother who is a fast bowler nailed a lot of flipper variations, pretty sure he did it just to piss me off!

Aside from the OBS the other backspun delivery I regularly bowl is more like Mushtaq Ahmed's 'nothing' ball. This delivery has the wrist and fingers all set up for a leg break but rather than twist the ball and release the ball is just rolled out the side of the index finger. Doesn't have the venom of a flipper but it does the job.
 
eh I tried bowling leg spin failed miserably but good to see all these variations cause I used to think there used to be just 2 variations when you bowl a legspin.
 
leftie600 said:
I've always thought of a flipper as a delivery where you give the ball an offspinners twist (clockwise) but the wrist is in the same position as you would have for a standard 45 degree leg break. The result of this is that the ball has a little bit of backspin and offspin with the key being that it doesn't behave like a legbreak but looks like a legbreak at delivery to an unobservant batsman.

All these other flipper variations are take the offspin twist all the way through the 360 degree loop (makes it sound so easy!).

Always fun to have a go at the different variations and I remember mucking around with the 'flipper googly' as a kid, bloody difficult to bowl and I don't think my shoulder would've lasted this long if I'd mastered it. My bloody younger brother who is a fast bowler nailed a lot of flipper variations, pretty sure he did it just to piss me off!

Aside from the OBS the other backspun delivery I regularly bowl is more like Mushtaq Ahmed's 'nothing' ball. This delivery has the wrist and fingers all set up for a leg break but rather than twist the ball and release the ball is just rolled out the side of the index finger. Doesn't have the venom of a flipper but it does the job.
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No, a true flipper uses this action (An old video that I should really update) I guess what you're describing is a variation that a finger spin bowler would use? Interesting what you're saying about your brother, did he use the Flipper technique when he bowled fast? This is one of the things that Amol Rajan talks about at the end of his book and I've tried to suggest the idea to my older son who's a fast bowler, but as yet he's not taken up the idea or shown any interest in it.
 
I've always found it very hard to master and generally unnecessary unless its the one missing link preventing you from being a test match leg spinner. There are far easier variations that are more effective at lower levels. I used to bowl it a bit when I was 13-14, but I soon gave it up as a waste of time. A slider does the same job and is harder to pick.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
No, a true flipper uses this action (An old video that I should really update) I guess what you're describing is a variation that a finger spin bowler would use? Interesting what you're saying about your brother, did he use the Flipper technique when he bowled fast? This is one of the things that Amol Rajan talks about at the end of his book and I've tried to suggest the idea to my older son who's a fast bowler, but as yet he's not taken up the idea or shown any interest in it.
Click to expand...

I understand what you're saying but in my opinion anything that has an offspin twist (I was a bit harsh on myself as I do put a little bit of work on the ball) and can be released with the wrist in the position for a legbreak can be called a flipper. Some flippers will obviously have more twist on them than others.

If we limit ourselves to a grip and not the outcome then I'm not even a legspinner!

My brother did muck around with variations when the team was winning in a canter or being smashed. He bowled a flipper once off his long run but felt it was very difficult to effectively put the flick on the ball. No issues with going round the loop though off the long run.
 
Been bowling in the street with my younger son. Heading into this season, it looks as though I'm going in with my leg break bowled in 3 ways... over-spin, 45 degree stock ball and a side spinner near enough at 90 degrees. Then a pure top-spinner using a really 'Fingery grip' which looks to be a very useful ball and a back-spinning flipper and a variation with an angled seam. Tonight I bowled a couple of balls (Flipper) releasing the ball very late and it kept ridiculously low. Both balls hit my son on the legs and he got the hump and called it a day, so I didn't get to check to see if I could repeat it again and again, I'll look to do that tomorrow, looked very promising though.
 
Chino#21 said:
What would you say are the most important things to consider when bowling the flipper? I've tried it a few times and I bowl it very erratically with little success or control at all. On the few occasions I manage to pitch it on a good spot it turns like a leg break due to the angled seam. It doesn't seem like I'll ever have control over its angle of spin or where it pitches.
More importantly for me, how do you get enough spin on your top-spinning leg break? Every time I try it the ball comes out with a wobbly seam, my side-spinning leg breaks are much better. Maybe because I "drag" down the side of the ball very effectively but struggle with dragging over the ball?
Click to expand...

With my top spinner I use a totally different grip - far more fingery, with the thumb playing a big roll. How much spin I get on it I'm not sure and it needs some work, but it does catch people out and it bounces loads and goes dead straight. I've also found that I only have to twist my wrist a little with this grip and I produce a Googly which is good news as I've not been able to bowl a Googly in any form for a couple of years now. The only thing is I seem to have to put a lot more effort in getting the ball up there and it's causing a degree of strain on my Deltoid, but this is something I always start off with, so I'm doing some work on it to get the muscle strong. This week though, I'm bowling really poorly for some reason, but again that something I always start off with when I get outside for some reason.

Currently I'm going out with 72 balls and bowling all of them, but I think because I've got so many balls I'm not taking it seriously and I'm trying to bowl all sorts of deliveries. I need to go with 6 balls and bowl as though I've got a 6 over spell and therefore focus on every ball and make it count and not be so experimental and work on what I'd do in a game. I'll try this tomorrow and see if I'm any better?

Flipper - that just needs a lot of practice over a couple of weeks and then to bowl it frequently once you go back to bowling your leg break. Yeah you're right they do turn a little which is useful. I don't seem to be able to get it to turn it consistently but that doesn't worry me.
 
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