someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
I've just had a bowl and video'd it, I'll have a look and see if it's not too embarrassing - I might upload it to youtube. I was trying to land it on the mat much of the time spinning it hard.
Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)
- Thread starter Richard the Third
- Start date
boogiespinner
Active Member
Thanks CP I am going to take your advice. Was itching to bowl variations this evening but just practised a basic topspun legbreak.
Cleanprophet
Active Member
Always worth uploading the video now and then. I don't think I've seen a video of you bowling since you've been spinning it as hard as you can.
Interestingly, I was having a think about a video I posted on here some months back (when I was bowling with all snow around me in the nets). I was thinking about that issue I have when trying to bowl flat out (hand coming over the top of the ball as in a topspinner/googly and not across like a legspinner/sidespinner). I thought (and it was suggested to me by leftie and one or two others) that I was getting the arm through too quickly and not rotating enough. I worked on that and filmed. I came to the conclusion that my body rotation is actually really good and my arm isn't getting ahead of that rotation. If anything, I think I may be over-rotating when bowling flat out and I'm losing shape and balance. There are some obvious signs, such as my follow-through taking me to the left, quite sharply sometimes. Plus also, my shape tends to crumble a little. I'm not as upright. When I looked back at my bowling back in the winter, I noticed I held my shape far better and my follow-through was straight down the pitch. Watching footage of Warne, I found that my action was very similar. But when I bowl flat out, I lose height and tend to over-rotate - causing me to lose balance as my weight heads to the left.
This isn't something I have much experience with. But I imagine that under-rotating and over-rotating would both effect your hand's release position? I need to focus on getting back to being a bit more upright, keeping the balance and ensuring the follow-through is down the wicket. I also need to make sure my left arm is straight down the wicket too. I noticed that that arm tends to splay out towards the legside rather than towards the batter.
There's always something to work on!
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
You're right, I've learned a lot since the last upload and bowl differently - more accuracy and spinning it harder. I've even made some discoveries in the last 2 days, I've been working with a lower arm action - just an hour or so ago I bowled 120 balls - mostly with the lower arm action and for some reason it seems to be very accurate and I've noticed that I get a bit of drift with it too, the ball comes out with more side spin, but only seems to grip 50% of the time and therefore goes on and doesn't turn which I don't mind. On the video - it just looks very slow, I might still upload it though.Always worth uploading the video now and then. I don't think I've seen a video of you bowling since you've been spinning it as hard as you can.
Interestingly, I was having a think about a video I posted on here some months back (when I was bowling with all snow around me in the nets). I was thinking about that issue I have when trying to bowl flat out (hand coming over the top of the ball as in a topspinner/googly and not across like a legspinner/sidespinner). I thought (and it was suggested to me by leftie and one or two others) that I was getting the arm through too quickly and not rotating enough. I worked on that and filmed. I came to the conclusion that my body rotation is actually really good and my arm isn't getting ahead of that rotation. If anything, I think I may be over-rotating when bowling flat out and I'm losing shape and balance. There are some obvious signs, such as my follow-through taking me to the left, quite sharply sometimes. Plus also, my shape tends to crumble a little. I'm not as upright. When I looked back at my bowling back in the winter, I noticed I held my shape far better and my follow-through was straight down the pitch. Watching footage of Warne, I found that my action was very similar. But when I bowl flat out, I lose height and tend to over-rotate - causing me to lose balance as my weight heads to the left.
This isn't something I have much experience with. But I imagine that under-rotating and over-rotating would both effect your hand's release position? I need to focus on getting back to being a bit more upright, keeping the balance and ensuring the follow-through is down the wicket. I also need to make sure my left arm is straight down the wicket too. I noticed that that arm tends to splay out towards the legside rather than towards the batter.
There's always something to work on!
With your bowling the falling away to the left is always noted by the experts as a no no. Everything must be going straight towards the stumps.
Cleanprophet
Active Member
Many people suggest you should aim to get that bowling arm fully vertical (12 o'clock). But, I've always bowled with slightly round arm (sort of 1 o'clock) and, of course, Warne always did too. I've always said that I felt I got more drift with that angle, but that may just be specific to me. As you say, changing that arm position may well mean the seam position changes. If some balls land on the seam and some don't, that's absolutely fine. As long as you keep it on off-stump and away from leg-stump. Sounds like you're really putting some work in!
Yeah, falling away to the left is not good. I read an article on Cricinfo last week about Mishra and he said he was falling away to the left and had to work on fixing it.
I also need to make sure my left arm is straight down the wicket too. I noticed that that arm tends to splay out towards the legside rather than towards the batter.
There's always something to work on!
I stand by what I said but we can only comment on what you've told us!
boogiespinner
Active Member
This was me bowling a few balls late last night. Just attempting topspun legbreaks. Not much memory in the camera so there was just a minute of footage. *WARNING* features side netting and other wide things.
Cleanprophet
Active Member
For sure, getting that arm through too quickly will result in the hand position not being where you want it. What you said was absolutely correct and it was something that I'd concluded too when I had a good think about it. The one problem we all have is that we can't see our bowling action when we bowl, so we can't be sure until someone else watches us or, of course, we film it and watch it back. Having watched it back, I don't think my arm is coming through too quickly after all. I expected the footage to clearly show the arm moving through quicker than the body rotation, but that wasn't happening. So, although that is a problem that can happen, I don't think it's the problem I'm having.
As I say, there is a clear difference in my action when I bowl within myself and when I bowl flat out. I do over-rotate and I tend to lose height. I think I need to work on keeping that shape and balance whilst trying to bowl flat out. If I do that and am still having issues with the release, then I will need to look at it again.
Cleanprophet
Active Member
I noticed that you have a bit of a wide approach to the crease. Could be worth making your run up a little straighter? Also, I'd take just a little bit more time between deliveries. You seem to be rushing a little bit.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Blimey your arm angle is Malinga-esque or rather Clarrie Grimmett-esque!
boogiespinner
Active Member
Really thanks for the encouragement guys it is really welcome. I have put so much work into this... really now I just want to cut out the wide stuff so I can hold down a spell instead of getting an over or two in exchange for turning up.
I didn't realise quite how low my arm was getting - I knew I was a bit round arm there. I know I am spinning the thing. I've gone for spin as the primary consideration then worry about controlling it philosophy. But I am really struggling with the control. I suppose Benaud did say it takes four years.
It's nice to know that that pace is ok. I've just been trying to measure those and I think they are around 15% off the speed of the top pros. I'm pretty happy with that.
I didn't realise quite how low my arm was getting - I knew I was a bit round arm there. I know I am spinning the thing. I've gone for spin as the primary consideration then worry about controlling it philosophy. But I am really struggling with the control. I suppose Benaud did say it takes four years.
It's nice to know that that pace is ok. I've just been trying to measure those and I think they are around 15% off the speed of the top pros. I'm pretty happy with that.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
In my case 8 years!! Pace-wise I have to think about Majid Haq and the fact that he takes wickets at his speed at international 1 day level. I've just spent 2 hour trying to upload a video edited in windows movie maker and for the life of me I can't figure out how to sign in to Youtube with it, it rejects the password every time - it's driving me nuts, I hate all this password crap - does my head in!
boogiespinner
Active Member
I'm puzzled about Majid Haq - I can't see anything which looks remarkably slow on youtube. Rashid looks slower to me.
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someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
In the last 1 day world cup he was bowling at only just over 30mph most of the time and taking wickets, it was the main talking point when he was bowling. I'm sure Rashid bowls much faster 45 - 48mph + ? I'll have a look at both again.
http://www.sportskeeda.com/cricket/majid-haq-the-slowest-bowler-who-plays-the-game
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Cleanprophet
Active Member
Very true. It is probably a bit too low. As we all know, a round arm action like that makes control of line much tougher.
Parry (Lancs) was bowling quite a few balls around 40mph in a T20 game a couple of days ago. He did bowl the odd ball at 55mph and even a bit quicker, but I think the majority were around 40mph.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Here it is after much faffing about trying to use windows movie maker I've eventually sussed it...
boogiespinner
Active Member
Dave your front leg is buckling!
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Probably, I'm bowling crap at the moment - still recovering from the Achilles injury, although the front leg isn't the one that's affected, but I think I'm just lacking in fitness generally and sub-consciously aware that all joints are weak? I'm getting tight thigh muscles at the back of that leg as well - might be the cause? I'll have a look at it when I bowl next.
Yeah looked - it looks awful!!!
Cleanprophet
Active Member
Probably, I'm bowling crap at the moment - still recovering from the Achilles injury, although the front leg isn't the one that's affected, but I think I'm just lacking in fitness generally and sub-consciously aware that all joints are weak? I'm getting tight thigh muscles at the back of that leg as well - might be the cause? I'll have a look at it when I bowl next.
Yeah looked - it looks awful!!!
Doesn't look too much of a problem to me. You definitely don't put use that front leg as much as you could, but I wouldn't worry about it as long as the ball does what you want it to.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Yeah I'm in two minds about working on it or leaving it until I get back to full fitness.
Warne's on sky commentating talking about Moeen Ali (He's just bowled Warner) and Bumble's just said about how much Moeen gets the ball to fizz, saying that you can hear it. Warne's just said "The secret to that is to have a really loose grip, that'll get the ball fizzing".