Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)

Top Contributors
macca said:
Well this is right. Jim should have got away with those waist high full bungers. Even the highest one sounded legit as long as its below the shoulder. You gotta watch these umpires.
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they've actually changed this is my league this season for some reason, now everything above the waist is a no ball. So this is possibly the case in Jim's league as well. I cannot understand the necessity for it but apparently its for 'easier clarification'. Mad isn't it?

Here's another far more controversial thing I've been thinking about. I'm reading David Frith's Bodyline Autopsy at the moment and naturally there's plenty to mention about Grum and Tiger and even Verity and Ironmonger who took a few wickets in the series. I can't find the page at the moment but he mentions that as time progressed over the years the umpires cracked down on the use of 'resin' by spinners, (can anyone clarify exactly what this resin was?) presumably used to improve grip and I'm guessing it was something they would have had in their pockets or wiped off the keepers gloves with a cheeky handshake and a 'well caught old boy' or something similar every so often.

So I was wondering is this considered cheating? What do people do to improve their own grip on the ball? Spit, dirt? and where do you draw the line? There are some interesting modern products out there which I have discovered and am going to try out in the nets just for the sake of argument and experimentation. I've ordered the dry one and the tacky one which should arrive today and I'll give em a go on Thursday. Let it be known I already feel dirty just talking about it...but its just a bit of fun! so please don't castigate me!

http://www.firstaid4sport.co.uk/Grip-Enhancers-CACCESS880/
 
GoldenArm said:
... I can't find the page at the moment but he mentions that as time progressed over the years the umpires cracked down on the use of 'resin' by spinners, (can anyone clarify exactly what this resin was?) presumably used to improve grip and I'm guessing it was something they would have had in their pockets or wiped off the keepers gloves with a cheeky handshake and a 'well caught old boy' or something similar every so often.
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Not quite GA... we are talking Law 42 here and ball tampering. At this time 'implements' were used to rough up one surface of the ball and 'resins' were used to shine the other. These resins could have been 'harvested' at the time as secretions from plants or conifers. If none were handy, the bowlers would run their hands and fingers through their hair and transfer the brylcreem to the shiny surface. This practice is a lot harder to get away with these days due to regular inspection, or TV cameras (!) and umpires can declare match suspensions if discovered.

The grip enhancers are not usually seen in cricket... I have not seen them anyway! However, I have seen them used in rugby matches.
 
shrek said:
Had a practice match yesterday where the entire club was divided into two teams and played against each other. There was only one keeper available for the match, so I kept wickets for one team. We have a leg spinner(other than myself) in the club and I put him in my team (as he was low on confidence). After a decent start to the season, he's been having trouble getting the release right, with full tosses headhigh and short pitches that bounce twice etc.

As soon as first wicket fell, I had him bowl to the no:3 who is a cautious player. Unfortunately, the leggies bad form meant no:3 got away with a few pulls off full tosses etc. First over 13 runs. Then a wicket fell at the other end, and the ex-captain of our team - also the best player of spin in our club came in to bat. I knew he would want to go after the leggie so I gave him
long on, long off, deep midwicket, deep square leg, deep cover, short extra cover, short midwicket, deep gully, point. and lo, he holed out to long off. That gave the leggie some confidence and the next two overs were decent - 5 and 6 runs each(a couple of wides in each over). At that time, I brought the sweeper cover and square leg in to cut off singles. In his third over he got another wicket caught a little outside the circle in the cover region. But then a leftie came into bat and he took 14 runs off his over so I had to take him off.
He bowled 4-0-38-2 and I kept telling him that I don't want him to lob legrollers and that I want him to get me wickets. I guess, at the end of the innings he might have felt a little better than before, but still a long way to go.

I took off my keeping pads to come on to bowl with the leftie batting - For most of my spell, it was the leftie on strike and I thought that I wouldn't bowl short and started off with a long on, deep midwicket, short midwicket, square leg, short fine leg, short extra cover, cover, point and long off. Unfortunately, I dropped one short in teh first over that was pulled for a 4. I realized I didn't have the control yet so, put the square leg back and brought in a wide leg gully to stop the single. Almost worked as the leftie hit out to deep midwicket but the catch was misjudged and went over the head of the fielder. But both of them played me cautiously, trying to pick off singles. Unfortunately, the infield didn't put any pressure on them, with a few misfields. So, I ended up leaking 3-4 runs an over easily. A couple of no-balls (balls heading fulltoss over the shoulder) included my analysis read 4-0-23-0. Not entirely satisfying, but not too bad either.

For the right hander, my field was mid on, mid off, deep midwicket (midway in from boundary), square leg, gully, short midwicket, cover, short extra cover, point. I know this was an overly aggressive field I could set only because I knew the batsman (no:3) wasn't confident of going over the top, but would have liked the fielders to actually stop the singles instead of letting the ball go through their hands.
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That's a Peter Philpott field http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_AEKdheDtC...eBe1j9Vfg_8/s1600/Peter+Philpott+Field+74.jpg
 
I think my league has the same no ball rule as GA mentioned (the rules aren't published online, but I will check the rulebook at the club next time I play). The other spinner who bowled before me almost had to end his spell for the same reason, as he bowled 2 no balls above waist height in an over, and the umpires started discussing it. I think they basically rule it as 2 is acceptable, the 3rd results in you getting taken off (a warning after 2 would have been nice. But the umpire was so un-bothered by it that I think he was a bit surprised when the batsman even complained!). I wouldn't have minded if they were blatantly high deliveries, but as I said, 2 of them were below waist height in my opinion, and the batsman was fairly short as well. The umpire even said "its not really dangerous", so you'd have thought a bit of common sense would have prevailed. But its league cricket, and their team were getting absolutely hammered. If they had been winning they would have lapped up the full tosses. Likewise, if the batsman wasn't so inept and had hit them for boundaries (rather than singles), then I'm sure he would have kept him lips firmly closed about it, its not my fault he missed out on easy runs.
 
My older son got bored of the queue in the nets on Tuesday night at the U13's training session and joined me in the outfield bowling the ball back and forth. Looks like as well as being a good seam bowler he's one of those people that can naturally bowl wrist spin or he's been listening to me all this time and keeping quiet. Although almost every night when they're on their way to bed, while one of them is getting ready the other one plays the Peter Philpott game with me where we stand opposite each other and try and spin the ball past one another, so he's been doing that for months now. But on Tuesday night he was bowling good Leg Breaks and good Wrong uns at a fair speed and a very good line and conssitently as well! The only possible issue was length which was a tad short sometimes, other than that I was very impressed. Maybe in a few years in the Sunday B team we'll have 3 Leg Spinners and all called Thompson!!!!
 
I played the first T20 game of the season last night. Turns out it wasn't quite as competitive as I imagined, the other side were probably similar in ability to the pub team I played for last season, and the whole game was played more as a bit of fun than anything else. We batted first and put 173 runs on the board off our 20 overs! There was little chance they would ever chase that down as we had a pretty solid team out. I came on after about 10 overs and they were already 5 wickets down and nowhere near the required run rate, so there was little pressure. It was getting quite dark so I didn't even bother setting a field as it would have taken a while to move everyone around, I just bowled. It was just my luck that they had probably their 2 best batsmen in when I came into the attack lol, one of them top scored for them, he must have been close to 50 when he got out near the end.

Anyway, my captain gave me 4 overs (apparently its 5 overs maximum) which is more than anyone else got, because he wanted to give me a proper go in a zero pressure game where it didn't really matter, because he knows I just need to bowl overs to try and find some consistency. I bowled my normal spell - 2-4 "bad" balls per over, of which 1, sometimes 2, are awful, and the rest are just below the standard I set myself. Then usually 1 or 2 really good balls. The first over wasn't too bad, one short ball outside off stump got slapped for 4 through mid-off, and a few singles. Apart from 2 short balls (one of which was a dot), the rest were either on a good length or slightly overpitched. I took a wicket with the final ball of the over. It was the first one I landed where I wanted it (leg stump line), on a perfect length, and it ripped. The batsman facing was a bit of a slogger, he wanted to play everything leg side, especially when the ball is pitching outside leg stump mostly. This one landed on that length where it was just full enough to tempt him to slog it leg side, but short enough to hit the pitch and turn before reaching the bat. He swang across the line, it turned massively (bearing in mind it only pitched about 4" in front of the bat) and went from being middled for runs, to hitting the outside/top edge (the bat was angled), and spooned up for a simple catch at short mid wicket I think. Another caught wicket, but this one was a proper one, not an ugly bad ball caught in the deep lol. I was pretty pleased with myself.

2nd over I started to try and increase my pace and energy, which resulted in a few wides and I lost my way a bit. 3rd over got even worse. I didn't feel like I was going for too many runs, but I just wasn't landing enough good balls. Even the occasional dot balls were usually bad balls that just didn't get punished, although I did land some cherries. Generally for the first 3 overs I landed 1 or 2 absolutely perfect deliveries, 1 got me the wicket, the other 3 or 4 threatened but the batsman got lucky. One pitched well outside leg, the batsman completely opened his stance to slog it legside and it turned back massive and nearly got through. It would have been bowled through the legs if it had!! The umpire at my end plays league cricket for a pretty good local side, and I've played him indoors (he was their only "proper" player I think) and he pulled a face at it as if he was quite impressed by the turn. I landed another one that over that pitched a few inches outside off stump on a good length, and quite rightly the batsman tried to smash it through cover, but it turned absolutely huge and beat everything, narrowly missing an outside edge into the keepers gloves.

I figured I would get taken off after 3 overs as my 3rd over was expensive, but I didn't. So I got my "bonus" over, and for some reason I just relaxed then. My 4th over was excellent. First ball was a bit loose but only a single, then the following 5 were all on the money or thereabouts. I turned a couple more massively, got a couple of dots, had a couple spooned up to where close fielders would have been who I had to move deeper in the early overs to cover my bad bowling (catch 22 situation there!). Everyone seemed to notice the difference, and it backed up my argument that it takes me 2-3 overs just to get loose before I even start to produce my best bowling (which is why bowling me in 2-4 over spells at weekends never really gets the best out of me). At one point I think the first team captain (who was fielding at mid-on) was talking about me to the midweek captain at mid-off, and it sounded pretty complimentary, with the usual "if he could land 6 good balls an over it would be great, but its just those bad balls that spoil it, but consistency will come with time", or words to that effect. That was the overall consensus at the end of the game as well.

4-0-36-1 (it didn't feel like I went for that many runs, and the scorer had never done it before so maybe it wasn't correct, but whatever) looks like a pretty hard day at the office, but if you took out the extras and the bad balls, then as is the case every week, it could have easily been 4-0-15-3.

I can't play the next 2 weekends, but I am playing midweek still, so I should have plenty of time to get some really good solo practice in, and hopefully I can nail some consistency in my action. It is so close to a major breakthrough in match performances, and if I can just find that little bit that is missing then I should be able to start taking loads of wickets and keeping the runs under control a bit.
 
A quick dilemma to run by everyone and see if they've got some ideas, because I am struggling a bit with it...

I don't want to sound too cocky, but I turn the ball absolutely huge pretty much every ball (4 out of 6 generally), my issue is that the line and length are often rubbish so the turn becomes irrelevant. But when I get my rhythm going, it creates a problem of which line to bowl.

If I land the ball on off stump then it will usually turn enough to get slapped through mid-off to cover. If my length is even a little short then its an easy late cut behind point for runs.

If I land the ball on middle stump then it will probably cause the most problems for batsmen as they can't easily decide to go off side or leg side as the ball will most likely turn on them. It brings LBW into play if the ball goes straight (but most batsmen at my level look to play me straight anyway if they aren't sure), but because the ball turns so much, I stand almost no chance of getting a clean bowled dismissal this way. Because I'm bowling so much faster now, only really good batsmen are bothering to use their feet to me (as the ball is as fast as many slow medium pacers, so lesser batsmen don't have the "air time" to make the decision to run down the wicket) so stumpings just aren't on the cards at all really.

In order to hit the top of off stump - that ideal delivery that is always spoken about - I have to bowl on leg stump or slightly outside. Even then it isn't always enough. The problem is that batsmen at my level don't play drives outside leg stump. As soon as they see the ball going in that direction, they have already thought "slog pull" or "slog sweep" before they even know where it is going to pitch! So the stance opens right up, and then there is a massive barrier of legs blocking the stumps off. I can't get LBW because its pitching on the leg side (most umpires don't dare give them on leg stump as its too close to call), but getting clean bowled is always difficult. This is why all my wickets this year are catches on the leg side, because it is removing my other options.

Sometimes I land the ball well outside leg, and then obviously you fully expect the batsman to smash it leg side. Yesterday one pitched miles outside on a very full length, and almost turned enough to bowl the guy behind his legs. If it had pitched 6" shorter I think it might have done!

Anyway, the dilemma is one of whether to bowl toward the leg side, knowing that this, IN THEORY, gives the most realistic dismissal options (caught, bowled, stumped, maybe LBW if the umpire is brave and it pitches on leg stump or just inside).

OR... bowl middle stump lines, knowing that umpires are reluctant to give LBW's anyway, especially if the ball is turning, but bowled being near enough impossible, stumped unlikely, and less chances of catches as batsmen will look to block more than attack.

I think the middle stump line will result in fewer runs, but I just can't help but feel its the wrong way to go. However the standard of batsmen I'm facing at the moment, and with the mentality every one of them is taking to my bowling, its just got me baffled as to where to go next. The zooter (OBS) and flipper have been pulled out of the box of tricks a few times already to batsmen that really open their stance up (as if it keeps low they will mow over the top of the ball and then bowled and LBW are very real possibilities). But I need to figure out a plan B.

I've thought about coming around the wicket, but its just too negative. Its odd, but I am actually hoping to bowl at some lefties, as I think it will be a lot easier when turning the ball this big to bowl to them over the wicket, and hope they close their stance to a ball that is straightening (and more).
 
Jim2109 said:
A quick dilemma to run by everyone and see if they've got some ideas, because I am struggling a bit with it...

I don't want to sound too cocky, but I turn the ball absolutely huge pretty much every ball (4 out of 6 generally), my issue is that the line and length are often rubbish so the turn becomes irrelevant. But when I get my rhythm going, it creates a problem of which line to bowl.

If I land the ball on off stump then it will usually turn enough to get slapped through mid-off to cover. If my length is even a little short then its an easy late cut behind point for runs.

If I land the ball on middle stump then it will probably cause the most problems for batsmen as they can't easily decide to go off side or leg side as the ball will most likely turn on them. It brings LBW into play if the ball goes straight (but most batsmen at my level look to play me straight anyway if they aren't sure), but because the ball turns so much, I stand almost no chance of getting a clean bowled dismissal this way. Because I'm bowling so much faster now, only really good batsmen are bothering to use their feet to me (as the ball is as fast as many slow medium pacers, so lesser batsmen don't have the "air time" to make the decision to run down the wicket) so stumpings just aren't on the cards at all really.

In order to hit the top of off stump - that ideal delivery that is always spoken about - I have to bowl on leg stump or slightly outside. Even then it isn't always enough. The problem is that batsmen at my level don't play drives outside leg stump. As soon as they see the ball going in that direction, they have already thought "slog pull" or "slog sweep" before they even know where it is going to pitch! So the stance opens right up, and then there is a massive barrier of legs blocking the stumps off. I can't get LBW because its pitching on the leg side (most umpires don't dare give them on leg stump as its too close to call), but getting clean bowled is always difficult. This is why all my wickets this year are catches on the leg side, because it is removing my other options.

Sometimes I land the ball well outside leg, and then obviously you fully expect the batsman to smash it leg side. Yesterday one pitched miles outside on a very full length, and almost turned enough to bowl the guy behind his legs. If it had pitched 6" shorter I think it might have done!

Anyway, the dilemma is one of whether to bowl toward the leg side, knowing that this, IN THEORY, gives the most realistic dismissal options (caught, bowled, stumped, maybe LBW if the umpire is brave and it pitches on leg stump or just inside).

OR... bowl middle stump lines, knowing that umpires are reluctant to give LBW's anyway, especially if the ball is turning, but bowled being near enough impossible, stumped unlikely, and less chances of catches as batsmen will look to block more than attack.

I think the middle stump line will result in fewer runs, but I just can't help but feel its the wrong way to go. However the standard of batsmen I'm facing at the moment, and with the mentality every one of them is taking to my bowling, its just got me baffled as to where to go next. The zooter (OBS) and flipper have been pulled out of the box of tricks a few times already to batsmen that really open their stance up (as if it keeps low they will mow over the top of the ball and then bowled and LBW are very real possibilities). But I need to figure out a plan B.

I've thought about coming around the wicket, but its just too negative. Its odd, but I am actually hoping to bowl at some lefties, as I think it will be a lot easier when turning the ball this big to bowl to them over the wicket, and hope they close their stance to a ball that is straightening (and more).
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I don't think you should be limiting yourself to one line and one pace, you have to change these things from batsman to batsman. That's where the real art comes into play, hence the necessity for mastering your technique and accuracy. For instance it sounds great to be aiming to hit the top of off stump but if you have a player who is biased to the leg side hitting that line is only going to be feeding him even if you set a heavily loaded leg side field. Far better to bowl a line with which he is less comfortable and force him to play shots he's not that good at, then slip in your top spinner and wrong un, otherwise you're going to bleed runs even if you do eventually bowl him. More likely you'll end up bowling worse because you're getting smacked all over the place. What you'll have to do is make sure you bowl very full and don't sacrifice your flight (you can still bowl quicker without bowling flatter), with a decent amount of turn and just one variation this will cause problems for most batsman.
 
I don't limit myself, and I'm always thinking about how I'm going to get someone out, its just that so far this season every batsman I've faced has played in the same style lol. I don't yet have the control to land the ball exactly where I want it, so my stock line tends to be around leg stump whether I like it or not. Once I find my rhythm I can alter the line more consistently, and obviously when players just want to smash everything legside, bowling at middle stump would seem to be a little more threatening. Maybe even bowling outside off stump and looking for the edge. But the wickets don't carry enough for many edges to make it as far as slip, so you're reliant on the keeper taking it. Which is ok in midweek as we have a good keeper, but at weekends the keeper is an older guy and his reflexes aren't what they probably once were.

I don't have a wrong'un, and my top spinner isn't that good. So that does restrict me somewhat when looking to bowl off stump lines. And my stock ball either turns massive or not at all, there isn't much in between lol.
 
Another thing that nobody has mentioned yet - Sky are showing live county championship matches!!! They have had Sussex vs Notts on this week, full coverage. No leg spinners afaik, but Swann, Patel and Panesar all bowling and taking plenty of wickets between them on a flat track. Hopefully they will show matches throughout the summer (as I have a feeling at present they are only showing it because there aren't any England internationals on), as it would be good to see Yorkshire, Durham and Essex for their leg spin in Rashid, Borthwick and Kaneria (assuming he is still there) respectively.
 
someblokecalleddave said:
Macca and GA - Who's this bloke? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sydney_Barnes


Here's a link that's got some good stuff in it about how hard this lark is.......
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Arguably one of the greatest bowlers of all time, I've read many accounts of his exploits, he's a much admired character. Philpott i think mentions him multiple times as does Frith, often along with a quote from him proclaiming that he SPUN the ball (old or new) and most certainly did NOT cut it, i think Frith actually mentions meeting him when he was in his 80's and stating that he had particularly long, skeletal fingers, perfect for wrapping round a ball a ripping it viciously. His style of bowling sounds to me to be quite similar to Chandrasekhar's or O'Reilly's. There's no footage i can find of either of those bowlers sadly, this type of fast leg spinner is a very, very rare breed. I don't think Afridi really counts either. Perhaps this kind of bowler is not as effective in the days of covered, featherbed pitches? so we don't tend to see them emerging from the ranks? Or is there just a dearth of talent? I would literally kill to see some proper HD, sky coverage of Mailey,Tiger, Barnes, Grum, Qadir etc... we've got all the tech and none of the talent!
 
Someone was talking about the use of resin, so here's what A.A. Mailey had to say in his wonderful book "10 for 66 and all that"
I accepted these standardized rules because I had come into cricket with them, but when the crazy idea of disallowing the bowlers to use resin to allow a better grip of the ball - and a law forbidding the lifting of the seam with the fingernail - blew in, I bade goodbye to this form of freedom and became a rebel.
Although it was against the law, I must break down and confess that I always carried powdered resin in my pocket and when the umpire wasn't looking lifted the seam for Jack Gregory and Ted McDonald. And I am still as unashamed as a Yorkshireman who appeals for l.b.w. off a ball which pitched two feet outside the leg stump.
Anyhow, I was in pretty good company. One day in Sydney, Johnny Douglas, the England captain, asked me to show him my hand. He held it for a while and then said "Arthur, you've been using resin. I'll report you to the umpire."
I asked him to show me his right hand, and looking at the thumb-nail I noticed it was worn to the flesh on the outside.
"You've been lifting the seam, Johnny," I said.
My co-rebel grinned and the matter was dropped.
On the following day I read in the paper: "Douglas and Mailey appear to be good friends again. They were shaking hands out in the middle yesterday."
This prohibition against resin was all the more unreasonable in that wicket-keepers were still allowed to use bird-lime on their gloves. Whenever I ran out of resin I used to spend a good part of the day shaking hands with Bert Oldfield, our 'keeper. When, after dropping a catch in the slips, I asked Herby Collins to move me to covers, Herby, the shrewdest of all captains, advised me to stay put. "You've got a better chance of lifting the seams for Jack Gregory and 'Stork' Hendry there."
I allowed myself to break this law with compunction because in lifting the seam I was keeping the ball in its original shape. The stitches on a brand-new ball are perceptibly raised, a peculiarity which allows the new ball to swerve more than an old one on which the stitches have been battered flat. Today, fast and medium bowlers rub the ball on their trousers but this has little or no effect compared with lifting the seam, though of course it is more lawful. Nevertheless, I know one Australian pace bowler who still lifts the seam.
The question of whether or not the seam should be lifted or resin used should be left to the umpire to decide. If his inspection of the ball reveals no damage, what right have the legislators to interfere? Seam-lifting and resin-dusting preserve but never destroy.
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GoldenArm said:
I don't think you should be limiting yourself to one line and one pace, you have to change these things from batsman to batsman. That's where the real art comes into play, hence the necessity for mastering your technique and accuracy. For instance it sounds great to be aiming to hit the top of off stump but if you have a player who is biased to the leg side hitting that line is only going to be feeding him even if you set a heavily loaded leg side field. Far better to bowl a line with which he is less comfortable and force him to play shots he's not that good at, then slip in your top spinner and wrong un, otherwise you're going to bleed runs even if you do eventually bowl him. More likely you'll end up bowling worse because you're getting smacked all over the place. What you'll have to do is make sure you bowl very full and don't sacrifice your flight (you can still bowl quicker without bowling flatter), with a decent amount of turn and just one variation this will cause problems for most batsman.
Click to expand...

Jim2109 said:
A quick dilemma to run by everyone and see if they've got some ideas, because I am struggling a bit with it...

I don't want to sound too cocky, but I turn the ball absolutely huge pretty much every ball (4 out of 6 generally), my issue is that the line and length are often rubbish so the turn becomes irrelevant. But when I get my rhythm going, it creates a problem of which line to bowl.

If I land the ball on off stump then it will usually turn enough to get slapped through mid-off to cover. If my length is even a little short then its an easy late cut behind point for runs.

If I land the ball on middle stump then it will probably cause the most problems for batsmen as they can't easily decide to go off side or leg side as the ball will most likely turn on them. It brings LBW into play if the ball goes straight (but most batsmen at my level look to play me straight anyway if they aren't sure), but because the ball turns so much, I stand almost no chance of getting a clean bowled dismissal this way. Because I'm bowling so much faster now, only really good batsmen are bothering to use their feet to me (as the ball is as fast as many slow medium pacers, so lesser batsmen don't have the "air time" to make the decision to run down the wicket) so stumpings just aren't on the cards at all really.

In order to hit the top of off stump - that ideal delivery that is always spoken about - I have to bowl on leg stump or slightly outside. Even then it isn't always enough. The problem is that batsmen at my level don't play drives outside leg stump. As soon as they see the ball going in that direction, they have already thought "slog pull" or "slog sweep" before they even know where it is going to pitch! So the stance opens right up, and then there is a massive barrier of legs blocking the stumps off. I can't get LBW because its pitching on the leg side (most umpires don't dare give them on leg stump as its too close to call), but getting clean bowled is always difficult. This is why all my wickets this year are catches on the leg side, because it is removing my other options.

Sometimes I land the ball well outside leg, and then obviously you fully expect the batsman to smash it leg side. Yesterday one pitched miles outside on a very full length, and almost turned enough to bowl the guy behind his legs. If it had pitched 6" shorter I think it might have done!

Anyway, the dilemma is one of whether to bowl toward the leg side, knowing that this, IN THEORY, gives the most realistic dismissal options (caught, bowled, stumped, maybe LBW if the umpire is brave and it pitches on leg stump or just inside).

OR... bowl middle stump lines, knowing that umpires are reluctant to give LBW's anyway, especially if the ball is turning, but bowled being near enough impossible, stumped unlikely, and less chances of catches as batsmen will look to block more than attack.

I think the middle stump line will result in fewer runs, but I just can't help but feel its the wrong way to go. However the standard of batsmen I'm facing at the moment, and with the mentality every one of them is taking to my bowling, its just got me baffled as to where to go next. The zooter (OBS) and flipper have been pulled out of the box of tricks a few times already to batsmen that really open their stance up (as if it keeps low they will mow over the top of the ball and then bowled and LBW are very real possibilities). But I need to figure out a plan B.

I've thought about coming around the wicket, but its just too negative. Its odd, but I am actually hoping to bowl at some lefties, as I think it will be a lot easier when turning the ball this big to bowl to them over the wicket, and hope they close their stance to a ball that is straightening (and more).
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Yeah It sounds to me Jim like you need to develop a lesser version of your Biggun so that you can bowl on the off-stump turning it away from the edge. Maybe also think of using your Orthodox Back-Spinner if you've not got a good top-spinning straight ball. If you then focus on bowling a lesser leg break with it turning to a lesser extent, you may find that your accuracy improves and you're able to get up around the off-stump in a more threatening manner, there will be the perception that if they miss it, with the lesser turn it may hit the stumps? Throw a few of those up with accuracy and differing amounts of turn and then bring in the biggun over the wicket pitched miles wide of Leg Stumps so they leave it and there you go either a wicket or at least a nervous batsman that's looking at it thinking 'Whoa! That turned a mile'!
 
GoldenArm said:
Arguably one of the greatest bowlers of all time, I've read many accounts of his exploits, he's a much admired character. Philpott i think mentions him multiple times as does Frith, often along with a quote from him proclaiming that he SPUN the ball (old or new) and most certainly did NOT cut it, i think Frith actually mentions meeting him when he was in his 80's and stating that he had particularly long, skeletal fingers, perfect for wrapping round a ball a ripping it viciously. His style of bowling sounds to me to be quite similar to Chandrasekhar's or O'Reilly's. There's no footage i can find of either of those bowlers sadly, this type of fast leg spinner is a very, very rare breed. I don't think Afridi really counts either. Perhaps this kind of bowler is not as effective in the days of covered, featherbed pitches? so we don't tend to see them emerging from the ranks? Or is there just a dearth of talent? I would literally kill to see some proper HD, sky coverage of Mailey,Tiger, Barnes, Grum, Qadir etc... we've got all the tech and none of the talent!
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Alfridi, you don't reckon he's similar in any way? Surely he must be the fastest around at the moment?
 
The boy done well! My older son, the one I commented about a couple of nights ago bowling wrist spin out of no-where returned to his usual seam up stuff tonight in a match against the best the southern half of the county could muster. He wasn't looking forward to it at all, realising that faced with The Super Human Crew he could only see that his bowling would get carted for 6's and 4's against such superior opposition. Remember he's joined a team that were smacked out of the league losing every single game but one last year. So little old Basildon and Pitsea faced up the best of Essex (Southern sector). They batted first in a T/20 format game were smashed by our boys into oblivion and my son Ben played an integral part in the process with figures of 4-3-2-3 one wicket maiden and a double wicket maiden and a bog standard maiden, he was well chuffed and one of the wickets was a bowled and caught and he had a run out in his third over as well. The little-un Joe (Wrist Spinner) now has got some incentive and he's gagging to play in his own age group where he should get a pile of wickets for no runs. He currently has the lowest economy of the lot at 2 an over, but he's now looking to get wickets to get his strike rate up around Ben's or better!
 
someblokecalleddave said:
The boy done well! My older son, the one I commented about a couple of nights ago bowling wrist spin out of no-where returned to his usual seam up stuff tonight in a match against the best the southern half of the county could muster. He wasn't looking forward to it at all, realising that faced with The Super Human Crew he could only see that his bowling would get carted for 6's and 4's against such superior opposition. Remember he's joined a team that were smacked out of the league losing every single game but one last year. So little old Basildon and Pitsea faced up the best of Essex (Southern sector). They batted first in a T/20 format game were smashed by our boys into oblivion and my son Ben played an integral part in the process with figures of 4-3-2-3 one wicket maiden and a double wicket maiden and a bog standard maiden, he was well chuffed and one of the wickets was a bowled and caught and he had a run out in his third over as well. The little-un Joe (Wrist Spinner) now has got some incentive and he's gagging to play in his own age group where he should get a pile of wickets for no runs. He currently has the lowest economy of the lot at 2 an over, but he's now looking to get wickets to get his strike rate up around Ben's or better!
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Wow good bowling and that would be a high standard opposition he was playing by the sounds of it. Everyones getting wickets on this thread at the moment.
 
Yeah we'd like to think that he's pretty good. Some of the first team adult players were at the match and they were very impressed as was one of the coaches today on Facebook, I don't think they were aware that as well as taking wickets he was very economic, I'm just in the process of up-loading the video to Youtube now.

We've all got a game tomorrow at 3 different Venues, so hopefully Joe and me will have some success tomorrow with our spin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJuKKIU02Q4
 
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