Leg Breaks To Left Hand Batsman!

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yeah, that psychology it takes to be a good spinner is huge, wanted to get that going again in another thread, its under rated, always mentioned briefly but never discussed enough!
interesting that his pace varies, i find bowling around the wicket fixes my action if i am not getting through the crease enough. As i cant face myself, im not sure if my pace varies naturally much, haven't paid as much attention to that aspect while training, unless its deliberate of course.
I think that bowling around the wicket if there is a bit of rough, and you can turn the ball is a great idea, if you arent turning it though, i think it may be a lot tougher, you arent going to bowl enough dangerous deliveries if you are just a 'tweaker' just my opinion though... i may be wrong.
 
Andrew Bourne said:
yeah, that psychology it takes to be a good spinner is huge, wanted to get that going again in another thread, its under rated, always mentioned briefly but never discussed enough!
interesting that his pace varies, i find bowling around the wicket fixes my action if i am not getting through the crease enough. As i cant face myself, im not sure if my pace varies naturally much, haven't paid as much attention to that aspect while training, unless its deliberate of course.
I think that bowling around the wicket if there is a bit of rough, and you can turn the ball is a great idea, if you arent turning it though, i think it may be a lot tougher, you arent going to bowl enough dangerous deliveries if you are just a 'tweaker' just my opinion though... i may be wrong.
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Its mostly psychology eh? but that dont mean to succeed you have to be this big overwhelming extroverted personality at the bowling crease.

Mallett and Grimmett were painfully shy and introverted people, mallett has written about it and it was severe. Grimmett taught mallett at one stage and what he told him was even though he was a very shy person and the thought of playing in front of any crowd made him want to vomit, you can suceed even at test level," if you can land 8(old days) in a shoebox, blindfolded"
 
yes, i totally agree. There are many ways to make a batsman feel your presence and the pressure of being out in the middle, extroverted personalities are just one way of achieving this.

Mallet and Grimmett impart the same pressure, purely through their cool calm persona, quietly landing the ball in the same spot...going about their business... the batsman couldn't see where they were going to get the bowler to crack.
Doesn't matter how you go about it... you still have to have your head in the game to be successful at that level, there isn't a lot of difference skill wise between those that make it and those that don't.
 
Andrew Bourne said:
i treat lefties the same way tcs does i think, i find that if you get straight, to any left hander, they feel comfortable.
not many left handers are very comfortable with a ball coming into them from outside off stump as they don't experience it very often.... vary the spin with them reaching to push into the offside seems to be my most effective method... but interesting to hear the other options floating around! would love to hear input from anyone who has had success going around the wicket a lot...
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I open the batting (left hander), and we occasionally get a leggie open the bowling against us - I always lick my lips. We had one the other week who started out pitching it up outside off against me, which I carefully defended, but then for some reason changed his line and started bowling straighter on a middle stump line. Well it was easy pickings from then on. He would have been much better off keeping it outside off, I only ever drive against the spin if I can hit it on the full toss, its just too risky otherwise.
 
SLA said:
I open the batting (left hander), and we occasionally get a leggie open the bowling against us - I always lick my lips. We had one the other week who started out pitching it up outside off against me, which I carefully defended, but then for some reason changed his line and started bowling straighter on a middle stump line. Well it was easy pickings from then on. He would have been much better off keeping it outside off, I only ever drive against the spin if I can hit it on the full toss, its just too risky otherwise.
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Do you think that it could be a viable option to have a go at you more often from around the wicket then? or do you think it makes it too easy to get tucked into gaps on the leg
 
Andrew Bourne said:
Do you think that it could be a viable option to have a go at you more often from around the wicket then? or do you think it makes it too easy to get tucked into gaps on the leg
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I think its probably easier to find the right areas from around the wicket, you seem to have a bigger target to aim for - but if you do get your line right, then over the wicket is more effective as it opens up more lbw/caught behind options. On the other hand, the googly is more effective from round the wicket, so it depends what you've got in your armoury.

As a batsman I don't really mind whether the bowler goes over or round, I'm still going to look to tuck the ball through the legside. My advice: leave a big gap at extra cover, see if you can tempt him to try and drive through it.
 
i really think it does come down to an accuracy thing based on what you say, it is much more dangerous for you to try and tuck a leggie who is bowling over the wicket than around if they can bowl the right lines.
 
Personally i love bowling to left handers, because it makes your googly and slider absolutely lethal. I like to stay over the wicket and bowl slightly faster, making the ball cut back into their off stump and forcing them to play a shot. Then every now and then throw a slider along the same line which continues across them rather than cutting back in. I bowled to a bloody good left hander on the weekend and used this method. It work really well, with every slider beating the outside edge and potentially looking like a wicket ball, the only problem came when some of my leg breaks were at poor lengths and he was able to get off strike.
 
I generally find that length is more important against LHB's than RHB's, as short balls can be tucked down the leg side extremely easily and fuller balls can be driven through the mid off area relatively free of risk. I remember my first ever match in senior cricket, at the age of 11, and I was actually a pretty good leg spinner. I came on in the 16th over (45 over match) and got a wicket maiden. Then, in my second over, I found myself facing a left hander. I hadn't ever bowled against a left hander, but I assumed that I just need to pitch it on off stump and then wickets would surely follow. Boy was I wrong! I got hit for three fours, a six and a single off of the last ball.

These days I assess the batsmen first and then come up with a plan. If the batsman seems set on defending every ball then I'll mix in a few topspinners and look for the outside edge. If they're using their feet then I bowl leg breaks, pitching outside off stump, maybe mix in some sliders or topspinners, but it's generally the big spinning and big drifting leg break that gets them out (or you can send in a quicker one to get them stumped)
 
loopylegspinner said:
I generally find that length is more important against LHB's than RHB's, as short balls can be tucked down the leg side extremely easily and fuller balls can be driven through the mid off area relatively free of risk. I remember my first ever match in senior cricket, at the age of 11, and I was actually a pretty good leg spinner. I came on in the 16th over (45 over match) and got a wicket maiden. Then, in my second over, I found myself facing a left hander. I hadn't ever bowled against a left hander, but I assumed that I just need to pitch it on off stump and then wickets would surely follow. Boy was I wrong! I got hit for three fours, a six and a single off of the last ball.

These days I assess the batsmen first and then come up with a plan. If the batsman seems set on defending every ball then I'll mix in a few topspinners and look for the outside edge. If they're using their feet then I bowl leg breaks, pitching outside off stump, maybe mix in some sliders or topspinners, but it's generally the big spinning and big drifting leg break that gets them out (or you can send in a quicker one to get them stumped)
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I've got the hang of bowling to left handers a bit this year, having struggled previously. I have found the key is to bowl a fullish length outside off stump to a 5-4 field, and really try to force them to play through the offside. I don't mind if they drive, I simply leave an extra cover deep to keep it to a single.

I think the big boost of confidence came when i was bowling when a lefthander came in who had scored 50 against us the previous game. I got him in three balls: two wrong'uns that went past the outside edge, then a big leg break that came back through the gate and hit the top of leg stump.
 
This is too good a thread to abandon it so...

I've just realized that the way I bowl to RHB's can also be used against LHB's. Bowl big spinning leg breaks on the left-handers off stump, these can quite easily be glanced away. Then throw in the odd backspinner and hey presto! They place inside the line and you either get an edge or bowled on off stump. This would probably work best from over the wicket.
 
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loopylegspinner said:
Other than denting your pride, developing an off break couldn't be a bad thing for these situations...
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Hi...
I'm new on Bigcricket, always wanted to join and finally have! This thread was really interesting for me, since I'm a chinaman (the exact mirror image of right arm leg spinners to left handers) and find it very strange that you seem to struggle against the southpaws. My stock ball (which I bowl from around the wickets) spins into the right handed batsman, and I actually feast off the righties. I think it has something to do with the line that I bowl (and of course the fact that I'm a chinaman which batsman have no experience against) My usual stock delivery will drift from the right handers middle stump or leg stump to half a foot or more outside the off stump, then turn back hitting leg stump. [sounds ridiculous but maybe I'll be able to show a video of me bowling later] Right handers always seem to play for non-existent away-turn, which leaves them vulnerable for through the gate dismissals.

As a left handed batsman, when facing leg spinners I can tell you that the perfect spot to bowl at is about a foot or a bit less outside the off stump, from around the wickets, with dip and a bit of drift! There is a natural "blind spot" if you can call it that on that spot. And there is certainly no need to start bowling off spinners! You never saw Murali resorting to bowling leggies when a right hander was hitting him! It never even bothered him that his stock ball spun in ! I believe that the theory that away-spinning deliveries are more difficult is pure nonsense, if you look at the records nearly all the best batsman struggles more with in-spinning deliveries. Ex. Lara, Ponting, Tendulkar, Chanderpaul etc. (Tendulkar was dismissed cheaply by legions of off spinners till his last test, Ponting vs Harbajan says it all, and Lara has an average of 35-something against Warne but 124 vs Murali, Chanderpaul vs Warne = Warne perhaps dominating?) Good outswing is probably more difficult to face than inswing, but it moves away through the air, and what also moves away through the air? An in-spinning delivery;)...

Now I'm not suggesting that everyone has difficulty facing in-spinning deliveries! Just that they have equal potential to take a wicket, after all most dismissals happen even before the ball bounces right? It's the same when bowling to left handers, you've just got to forget all that talk about in-spinners and bowl your heart out! True, the accuracy thing is an issue, but you'll never get better at it if you don't practice it constantly. You can't expect accuracy to just happen, it comes through sheer hard work.

The over/round problem... I like to go around the wickets, because it gives you a good angle to turn the ball more than over the wickets. Naturally the batsman will have to allow for some turn when he plays a forward defensive shot, so anything that turns a bit less will catch the outside edge, anything going in the other direction will beat the outside edge (potential stumping) and anything that turns more will go past the bat and hit the pad. From over the wickets, drift the ball from outside leg to outside off (not necessarily very far just so far that it doesn't land on the stumps) and spin the ball back enough to cramp the batsmans' style (not enough room to cut, pitched too full to pull) These tactics may not work for you but you have to find your individual strength against southpaws and exploit any weaknesses you see.

Good luck... Please don't defile our art by turning to the "evil craft" of bowling seam-up when there is a southpaw:confused:
 
Jacques Voigt said:
9

Hi...
I'm new on Bigcricket, always wanted to join and finally have! This thread was really interesting for me, since I'm a chinaman (the exact mirror image of right arm leg spinners to left handers) and find it very strange that you seem to struggle against the southpaws. My stock ball (which I bowl from around the wickets) spins into the right handed batsman, and I actually feast off the righties. I think it has something to do with the line that I bowl (and of course the fact that I'm a chinaman which batsman have no experience against) My usual stock delivery will drift from the right handers middle stump or leg stump to half a foot or more outside the off stump, then turn back hitting leg stump. [sounds ridiculous but maybe I'll be able to show a video of me bowling later] Right handers always seem to play for non-existent away-turn, which leaves them vulnerable for through the gate dismissals.

As a left handed batsman, when facing leg spinners I can tell you that the perfect spot to bowl at is about a foot or a bit less outside the off stump, from around the wickets, with dip and a bit of drift! There is a natural "blind spot" if you can call it that on that spot. And there is certainly no need to start bowling off spinners! You never saw Murali resorting to bowling leggies when a right hander was hitting him! It never even bothered him that his stock ball spun in ! I believe that the theory that away-spinning deliveries are more difficult is pure nonsense, if you look at the records nearly all the best batsman struggles more with in-spinning deliveries. Ex. Lara, Ponting, Tendulkar, Chanderpaul etc. (Tendulkar was dismissed cheaply by legions of off spinners till his last test, Ponting vs Harbajan says it all, and Lara has an average of 35-something against Warne but 124 vs Murali, Chanderpaul vs Warne = Warne perhaps dominating?) Good outswing is probably more difficult to face than inswing, but it moves away through the air, and what also moves away through the air? An in-spinning delivery;)...

Now I'm not suggesting that everyone has difficulty facing in-spinning deliveries! Just that they have equal potential to take a wicket, after all most dismissals happen even before the ball bounces right? It's the same when bowling to left handers, you've just got to forget all that talk about in-spinners and bowl your heart out! True, the accuracy thing is an issue, but you'll never get better at it if you don't practice it constantly. You can't expect accuracy to just happen, it comes through sheer hard work.

The over/round problem... I like to go around the wickets, because it gives you a good angle to turn the ball more than over the wickets. Naturally the batsman will have to allow for some turn when he plays a forward defensive shot, so anything that turns a bit less will catch the outside edge, anything going in the other direction will beat the outside edge (potential stumping) and anything that turns more will go past the bat and hit the pad. From over the wickets, drift the ball from outside leg to outside off (not necessarily very far just so far that it doesn't land on the stumps) and spin the ball back enough to cramp the batsmans' style (not enough room to cut, pitched too full to pull) These tactics may not work for you but you have to find your individual strength against southpaws and exploit any weaknesses you see.

Good luck... Please don't defile our art by turning to the "evil craft" of bowling seam-up when there is a southpaw:confused:
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What would usually get you out as a LHB? Is it the big spinning leg break or something that goes straight on?
 
loopylegspinner said:
What would usually get you out as a LHB? Is it the big spinning leg break or something that goes straight on?
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The big ripper most of the time. (I pick anything that goes the other way / straight on) And I have noticed that almost every left hander at my club has the same weakness against a leg break that pitches on that unplayable length. I can't give you any numbers ex. pitch the ball that precise distance from the stumps:confused: but if a left handed batsman is looking to slog sweep you but he misses and the ball turns into the stumps, or he tries to cover drive a delivery that is a bit too square to drive and he gets bowled through the gate it should pitch in more or less the same spot. My best guess is the ball lands about 1.5 meters from the batsman. If it's a fiercely spun leg break and it pitches there me and lots of other lefties try to play risky shots. A very good batsman would probably pick the length fast enough to know whether to go forwards or backwards.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=Tw5_hLpcGEo
Warne makes it look easy:D...
 
loopylegspinner said:
What would usually get you out as a LHB? Is it the big spinning leg break or something that goes straight on?
Click to expand...


Its been a few years since I last got out to a spinner, but certainly the deliveries that make me most nervous are the ones pitched up outside off stump inviting me to drive against the spin.
 
http://www1.skysports.com/watch/video/8863735/shane-warne-spin-masterclass

You can thank DutchGuy for that great video!:D...
Shane Warne says that he preferred bowling to left handers in the second innings when the ball is really turning, and I can understand why! There are countless tactics and plans that you can use against them, I'm actually jealous that I'm stuck turning everything away from them:( One thing you might also consider doing that Warne didn't mention, is using the reverse of the crease tactic against left handers. Start in the middle of the crease from around the wickets, then wider, and the next ball wide of the crease from over the wickets.
 
SLA - honestly?

"Its been a few years since I last got out to a spinner, but certainly the deliveries that make me most nervous are the ones pitched up outside off stump inviting me to drive against the spin".
 
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