list you prefered 3rd test team

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Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Siddle has been spanked to all corners against Northampton, 3 overs and his gone for 20+. Clarke has already taken a wicket. Siddle spot's is going to come under some pressure I'd imagine. Apparently Edgbaston will be slow and low. But it sounds like it will be somewhat underprepared.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

watson took 2 wickets in the five overs he bowled for 20 runs. he was the second best bowler of the day with clark beating him with a very good 14 overs for 3.2 rpo with 2 wickets. he looked fit and bowling well, and took the two the wickets of the two most important batsman. siddle bowled terribly at the start of the day as LtD said but came back pretty strongly to get to cheap wickets. went for 5.7 rpo. i would have to say clark may just have his spot if johnson is left in there as he should be. johnson bowled for 6 rpo and is still having trouble. i think its just the english pitches and duke balls personally. i would play him in the third test. hauritz bowled strongly, no wickets but enough to keep him in the side. mcdonald bowled tightly but was hit for a couple of bigger overs. did enough to keep him in contention, especially with his batting performances. he was promoted to opening with hughes and both got half centuries, hughes with an enforcing 65 (81) with 10 fours and a six, and mcdonald doing just as well, if not better, with 69 (75) with 8 fours.
mcdonald and watson both going very well, i would have to say that north may have just lost his spot. i would expect north to come in no.4 after watson at 3 to salvage his spot. i would play watson, he did well.

this is what clark had to say about the days play and why i think he should have been playing since the first test: Cricket Australia News
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Clark got the 2 most important batsmen? Thats a laugh and a very interesting way to describe a bloke in his 6th first class match and an average of 17 :D

But you are right about Siddle getting cheap wickets, the oppositions best batsman is a very cheap wicket indeed :)
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

i meant to say two OF the best batsman, opener and number three. essential wickets no matter who they are.

only one of his three wickets were really his doing, and that was that best batsman you were talking about. the other two were batsman throwing away their wicket. not to take anything away from siddle though, it was a good performance, just not as good a performance as clark. he constantly beat the bat over and over and leaked very few runs. when comparing the two you would have to say clark was the better bowler in comparison to his supposed 'replacement'.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

The problem is our bowling attack is reliant on good line and length bowling and a low run-rate. This was the corner-stone to our success in SA. Siddle and Johnson have both been expensive, this hinders the effectiveness our attack.

One of them has to go, at this stage Siddle would have to be in that firing line. He nevers gets a lot of movement at the best of times, rather he relies on accuracy, bounce and a bit of seam and reverse swing with the older ball.

So far he hasn't had accuracy, the wickets haven't had much bounce but on occasions his extracted some good movement. The problem is it hasn't been consistent and too many runs have been leaked.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

if clark doesnt play tonight then i am going to find a corner to cry in. absolute stupidity to ignore a man of his pedigree.

and the watson/hughes dilema as well. i can often find a lot of sense in the aussie selectors where other people criticise them, but these two moves have left me dumfounded. why the hell did they pick siddle in the first place?
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Boris;358207 said:
if clark doesnt play tonight then i am going to find a corner to cry in. absolute stupidity to ignore a man of his pedigree.

and the watson/hughes dilema as well. i can often find a lot of sense in the aussie selectors where other people criticise them, but these two moves have left me dumfounded. why the hell did they pick siddle in the first place?
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Answer: Because he did well last summer, when your other heroes weren't around to play against the best Test team in the world. You know what you're going to get with Siddle and he doesn't let the team down.



a for effort;358248 said:
victoria
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Granted, that would count against him. He is the one bowler selected in the national team from a state whose pace attack has been consistently the best performed in all conditions for at least 3 years.



Cricket's a big statistics game, and full of ifs & buts. Look at Siddle again though in that 2nd Test - with Ponting not still dwelling on a missed run out, intead holding his hands they way he should to catch the ball in slips (nothing Siddle had control over) - and would your view still be the same?

I will concede these conditions are not best for his bowling (low & slow), as we have seen time & time again in the past. That is why I have been advocating the likes of Hilfenhaus & McDonald to now. It's England, not Barbados.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Sober Symonds;358324 said:
Answer: Because he did well last summer, when your other heroes weren't around to play against the best Test team in the world. You know what you're going to get with Siddle and he doesn't let the team down.
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too late, has done that with all three forms of his game, especially the fielding department. i dont know why both him and ponting insist on putting him on the boundary. he isnt the greatest of catchers and has the worst arm i have seen in international cricket. fielding IMO is just as important as batting and bowling and when playing him they are effectively a fielder down because batsman will always run one where there shouldnt be any, two when there should be one, three when there should be two, etc. pietersen was running ones off of his arm when he was standing at a shortish mid on. i know im nitpicking, but im just adding another addition to why i dont like him as a player, or as a person. i know hes a brilliant bowler, you have to be to get near that level anyway, but i cant help but think there are much better opportunities. i would rather play shane harwood, for example, in my list of other people better then him for that spot, and it is of a decent length too. the selectors have made an issue with selecting him though as he has done well. for example if ponting were to get injured now and be out of the game for a year, besides maybe losing his captaincy for a long term replacement, hodge would most likely come in for him IMO. but once ponting is fit hodge, no matter how well he plays, will be whipped straight back out in favour of pontings pedigree. this didnt happen with lee and clark. they were both in the best form of their career, and dont argue against that cause that year they were both averaging 22 and 19 respectively, with lee having the most amount of wickets in a calender year at the time and clark number 3 on that list, the got injured. instead of putting in a replacement like they usually would with an older player that has had test experience but just forced out of the side by a margin, like hodge, should have come in for them. this is just an example but i would have played bracken because i know that the two of the best 3 bowlers in the world at that point in time were going to make a comeback in the future. what the selectors have done instead is select an up and comer to start his lengthy test career. which means that they are either refusing entry to two huge talents who pretty much won match after match in the lack of form with the batting, or the two players coming back after injury are going to perform well and force the up and comer out of the side. love him or hate him siddle has a future in test cricket. sooner or later the selectors will have to give in to clark and lee as they rip apart domestic cricket in their relatively young age, and if siddle has one drop in form he is gone for a few years, forced back to domestic level maybe to be outshone by his replacement in the state team if lee and clark make it back into the side. it is unfair not only on experienced players who had concreted their spots in the side, but on siddle that he was picked. sounds crazy, i know, but he may now be unable to continue international games if he makes just one hiccup. if bracken was played instead then as soon as clark or lee comes back then bracken can be whipped out of the side and they are put back. then if they dont perform in the following month it is THEN time for siddle to be picked. one good season after 3 or 4 ordinary ones at domestic level doesnt show consistency, so if he wound together one more season he would have been a definite in the side. now he is left fighting for his spot against two combined 100 test veterans with records to back them.
but now the selectors are probably going to stick with siddle and ignore lee and clark bashing on their doors desperate to play for the team they should be in. its not fair on any of them that the pattern that australian selectors have used for at least 25 years on my count has been broken by a couple of more routine injuries and a 'great' youngster using his success as a facade to how he shouldnt be at international level. sorry siddle.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Of course Siddles inclusion over Clark especially this match surely couldnt have anything to do with the fact that Siddle is a better bowler with the new ball and they want to push Johnson back to 1st change, no of course not

Why should they change the team suddenlyjust because Clark is back fit? Wow, he ripped through the West Indies and New Zealand but in between was slaughtered by India. Siddle did his job well against South Africa, the no2 side in the world and earnt his spot, Johnson is more out of form and would be a more likely person for Clark to replace, but they will give him another shot, Clark is 34, he is coming to the end of his career, why push out a young player for a bloke who may not even be playing in 12 months time? He isnt that good

As for Lee, he was probably going to play if he was fit, instead Hilfenhaus has come in and done very well, batsmen are completely different to bowlers and your comparison is way off, besides if Ponting had a 12 month injury now he probably wouldnt be back and they would look at a younger replacement
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

eddiesmith;358358 said:
Of course Siddles inclusion over Clark especially this match surely couldnt have anything to do with the fact that Siddle is a better bowler with the new ball and they want to push Johnson back to 1st change, no of course not

Why should they change the team suddenlyjust because Clark is back fit? Wow, he ripped through the West Indies and New Zealand but in between was slaughtered by India. Siddle did his job well against South Africa, the no2 side in the world and earnt his spot, Johnson is more out of form and would be a more likely person for Clark to replace, but they will give him another shot, Clark is 34, he is coming to the end of his career, why push out a young player for a bloke who may not even be playing in 12 months time? He isnt that good
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clark single handedly destroyed you guys 2 yrs ago, PLEASE look up his record, i have posted it somewhere on this site for you to see but you completly ignored it, fact is he averages 22 and he has averaged better than that against England and SA, as ive told you before, he isnt the first quick to fail in india and he wont be the last.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

distributer of pain;358359 said:
clark single handedly destroyed you guys 2 yrs ago, PLEASE look up his record, i have posted it somewhere on this site for you to see but you completly ignored it, fact is he averages 22 and he has averaged better than that against England and SA, as ive told you before, he isnt the first quick to fail in india and he wont be the last.
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I've seen his record

Did very well in the most seamer friendly conditions ever produced in South Africa, did well against the might of NZ and the West Indies whilst India played him easily enough in Australia and smashed him over there, Sri Lanka had no trouble against him and Bangladesh even belted him around :D

That 1 series in Australia when McGrath and Warne were still around is the only time he has done well outside of a seam bowlers paradise. His medium pacers would be slaughtered on this pitch and the Oval, they would be better off with McDonald, similar pace but Macca can actually bat and will make the batsmen play more often


Siddle is the future, Clark is the past
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

Honestly, I think they have the team right.

In Cardiff, we looked really shallow with our bowling stocks in the first innings. When Ponting can't rely on Johnson to bowl 20-25 in an innings, the other three are exposed somewhat. I think Siddle is probably the most on edge bowler but he has been desperately unlucky. I sadly doubt we will see Lee this series, and Hauritz has grown remarkably on this tour, so I think Siddle for Clark would be the only potential change.

Watson has plenty of detractors but I think him playing well could be the best thing for Australian cricket since Warne and McGrath retired. A change needed to be made in the batting line up though; the Aussie selectors were complacent with their side in that series when Katich, Martyn and to a lesser extent Clarke were really struggling, but all the batsmen struggled their way through the five tests. It's a shame that Hughes is the one that has to miss out, and there is no doubt he will be a champion, but right now he looks really susceptible. Watson has already looked solid and continued to prove the theory that Flintoff is barely above average against right handers, and if he can take a wicket or two in this match or even just bowl 15-25 tight overs, he has been invaluable.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

yeah a right left opening combo is the way to go, especialy with the trouble the leftys have had with freddy, i heard last night on SBS that watsons the first right hander to open for us in ages, i was surprised to hear that but its true.
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

distributer of pain;358371 said:
yeah a right left opening combo is the way to go, especialy with the trouble the leftys have had with freddy, i heard last night on SBS that watsons the first right hander to open for us in ages, i was surprised to hear that but its true.
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... 8 years, I think they said. But if they're good enough - as they have been all that time - it really doesn't matter, does it?

Can't agree they've got the team right, Arm Ball. The series scoreline says it all. You've conveniently neglected to mention Hussey & Johnson. Their abysmal form is not going away. North in for his spin - hardly bowls. Now Boris wants Siddle out because he's no Brett Lee in the field. If we're going to compromise by not having our best opening batsmen, best middle-order batsmen, and best bowlers, we will be found out.

Watson is in great form, and he batted well. That is a good thing. Steady-on though, we're singing his praises a bit early, I fear. At the end of the day, he is not an opener and I think it is a bit much to expect we're going to be able to go on with an all-rounder at the top of the order. Think of what he would be like after bowling 20 overs then coming in at 5.30pm, as does happen. This bloke is no freak. Just a talented, hard-working cricketer with kick-able head an extremely fragile body.:D
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

You will never find out as he will never bowl 20 overs and if he tried he wouldnt be batting :p
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

i dont think watson opening is a viable long term option, id like to see hughes come back in for the 4th test, drop hussey and make clarke bat at 4 with watson at 5, watsons shown he's capable of big hundreds in 1st class cricket so i think he'd be wasted at 7, id also drop siddle and play clark in the next test, also i hate to admit it but i think a bracken or a bollinger would ideally suited to the swing conditions. horses for courses, id even go as far to say to hussey that if want to play in the 4th test then you have to keep, theres no shane warne in this team so keeping isnt that hard considering he's very capable of doing it whilst haddins injured, we have to win both the remaining tests so we have to throw caution to the wind, this match will be a draw.
the below teams are on the condition that lee wont be fit, if he is fit id still prefer him to get a tour game under his belt before selection.
hughes
kattich
ponting
clarke
watson
north
hussey *K*
johnson
hauritz
hilfinhaus
clark
***or this team***
watson
kattich
ponting
clarke
north
hussey *K*
mcdonald
johnson
hauritz
clark
hilfinhaus
 
Re: list you prefered 3rd test team

distributer of pain;358527 said:
i dont think watson opening is a viable long term option, id like to see hughes come back in for the 4th test, drop hussey and make clarke bat at 4 with watson at 5, watsons shown he's capable of big hundreds in 1st class cricket so i think he'd be wasted at 7, id also drop siddle and play clark in the next test, also i hate to admit it but i think a bracken or a bollinger would ideally suited to the swing conditions. horses for courses, id even go as far to say to hussey that if want to play in the 4th test then you have to keep, theres no shane warne in this team so keeping isnt that hard considering he's very capable of doing it whilst haddins injured, we have to win both the remaining tests so we have to throw caution to the wind, this match will be a draw.
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You've been very kind to Hussey and Johnson. At least Johnson had some form before this series, which is more than one can say about Hussey. Why should he be thrown a lifeline as a 'keeper? I can't get my mind past a total dog's breakfast behind the stumps if he were given the gloves. If anything, he should have been the one put up to open the innings, considering the bulk of his 1st Class runs were scored there.

I'm willing to concede Siddle's spot, but only for a swinging option. I've said from the start the Hilf, Bollinger, McDonald types who can bend the ball should be played in these conditions. They're not made for blokes who bang it in hard. I would have thought with all the technology and research put into the current game, that Australian selectors & team management would be smart enough to be know with this. But Holdsworth in '93, Lee in '01 & '05, Mitchell & Siddle '09 ... they won't learn.
 
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