Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

fredbassett

New Member
Re: North A & B

ROY G BIV;340406 said:
If SEN A was scraped:

Based on 2008/09 Ladder positions this is one scenario:
Some clubs would not be too pleased if this was to eventuate, namely St Albans a NTH A power, Albion last years premiers and regular contenters

NORTH A
Doutta Stars
Hoppers Crossing
Williamstown CYMS
Sunshine Druids
Strathmore
Keilor Park Nth A Premiers
Avondale Heights
Gr$$nval$
Tullamarine
Westmeadows
Sunshine United
Werribee Centrals Nth B Premiers
Parkville District

Phew!!!Not many easy games in this grade.


NORTH B
Albion
St Albans
East Keilor
Footscray United
Aberfeldie
Seddon
Seabrook
Moonee Valley
Flemington
Craigieburn
Jacana
Aberfeldie Park
Westmeadows

As strong as Nth B has ever been, standard would improve 2-3 fold.At least up the top half of the ladder. 13 in NORTH B
what about a west and north division, with the top 6 teams from both divisions forming nth a the season after , with the rest in north b ??????
 
Possible breakup of Senior A into North and South.

All discussion about the possibility of disbanding Senior A into seperate North & South divisions will now go here.
 

jika jika

Member
Re: North A & B

ROY G BIV;340691 said:
OK JIKA ur suggestion is good, but in my defense i only came up this scenario on a whim.

According to 3 teir NORTH SOUTH structure, again based on ladder positions we could have shape:

The only issue i have with 8 team comp is finals and relegation battles are settled quite early. Just llok at NTH B in recent years we would know well in advance which 4 clubs would be vying for the finals spot and which would occupy the bottom 2 possies. SO that would be my only criticism of 8 teams in a division.

With 12 teams we have found that almost every year you don't really know who finishes get relegated and who finishees 3rd or 4th until the completion of the final rnd. So a compromise would be to welcome some new clubs in vtca and make Noth A,B,C atlest 10 team per Divisions. WIth 1 promoted and 1 or 2 relegated.

NORTH A

Doutta Stars
Hoppers Crossing
Williamstown CYMS
Sunshine Druids
Strathmore
Keilor Park Nth A Premiers
Avondale Heights
Tullamarine


NORTH B

Gr$$nval$
Westmeadows
Sunshine United
Werribee Centrals Nth B Premiers
Parkville District
Albion
St Albans
Footscray United



NORTH C

East Keilor
Aberfeldie
Seddon
Seabrook
Moonee Valley
Flemington
Craigieburn
Jacana
Aberfeldie Park
PLus any other clubs joining the VTCA.

My guess at new structure (if it happens)

Senior: Yarraville Club, Keilor, AWSC, RPB, Sth Caulfield, McKinnon, Youlden Parkville, Spottswood, OEG, Altona North, St Bernards, Willy CYMS (announced before season began that both senior A grand Finalists were being promoted).

North 1 or North A: Doutta, Hoppers, Sunshine Druids, Strathmore, Sunshine United, MHSOB, Keilor Park, Avondale Heights ( doutta relegated from senior, KP and AH both promoted )

Sth 1 or Sth A: Hampton, Brighton Districts, Maccarbi, Beumauris, Bentleigh, Cheltenham, Port Melb, Chealsea (Hampton relegated from senior, PM and Chelsea promoted)

North 2 or North B: Tullamarine, Greenvale, Parkville, West Meadows, Albion, St Albans, Foots United, Werribee Centrals ( no relegated teams, WC promoted)

South 2 or South B: Old Mentone, Murrambeena, Parkdale, Mentone, Middle Park, Moorabin Park, Dingley Heatherton (no relegated teams, Heatherton promoted)

North 3 or North C: East Keilor, Seddon, Aberfeldie, Moonee Valley,Aber Park, Craigiburn, Jacana, Seabrook, Flemington (plus 1 new team) EK, Seddon, Abers relegated teams

South 3 or South C: Highett, Bon Beach, Carnegie, Aspendale, NC/G, Clayton Dist, East Malvern, Parkdale United, Sth Yarra (plus 1 new team) Highett is relegated team

Senior Div to stay 9 x 2 dayers, 2 x 1 dayers

Div 1& 2 for south and Nth 7 x 2 dayers, 7 x 1 dayers

Div 3 for sth and North - Depends on number of new teams recruited

See how we go
 

fencesitter

New Member
Re: North A & B

Ok , given that there are 10 nth & 2 sth in Senior Div , how do you think relegation will work ?
1 up 1 down would mean there would be forever that difference in north/south.
 

jika jika

Member
Re: North A & B

ROY G BIV;340691 said:
The only issue i have with 8 team comp is finals and relegation battles are settled quite early. Just llok at NTH B in recent years we would know well in advance which 4 clubs would be vying for the finals spot and which would occupy the bottom 2 possies. SO that would be my only criticism of 8 teams in a division.

With 12 teams we have found that almost every year you don't really know who finishes get relegated and who finishees 3rd or 4th until the completion of the final rnd. So a compromise would be to welcome some new clubs in vtca and make Noth A,B,C atlest 10 team per Divisions. WIth 1 promoted and 1 or 2 relegated.

Your right 8 team comps can on occasions be decided early, but so can 12. Senior A top 4 was done with 3 games to go this year, whilst battle for bottom 2 went to last day. It will change from year to year. 8 team draw in theory is the fairest you can get in cricket, play all opposition once at home and once away in a 1 dayer and a 2 dayer. Baring weather, its almost perfect
 

jika jika

Member
Re: North A & B

fencesitter;340963 said:
Ok , given that there are 10 nth & 2 sth in Senior Div , how do you think relegation will work ?
1 up 1 down would mean there would be forever that difference in north/south.
clubs based nearest to the city, eg: MHSOB, rpb, Youlden, Port Melb, Willy CY's, Maccarbi may swing between nth & sth to keep basic structure sound. You can't start Senior Div with an even 6 and 6 or along with Doutta you relegate OEG, Altona Nth to the north, dont promote 3 of the 4 finalists from Senior A ( St B, Willy, Hoppers) because they are northern based keep Hampton up (who finished below OEG and AN) and promote teams that finished 3, 5, 6 (brighton, maccarbi, and Beumauris) from senior A because they are south based. Good luck selling that idea
 

jacko66

Member
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

If SnrA dissapears, what happens to the Reserves? Currently split into Nth, Central and South each with 8 sides. The logic would be that Snr becomes a "home and away" comp with 1's and 2's playing the same club each week. I'd be in favour, despite the extra travel.
 
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

Heard from a reasonable source that with Senior A gone, that the new North A and South A divisions will only be 8 teams.

Each team will play each other once in a two-day match, and once in a one-day match.
 

7/564

Member
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

Northern $uper$tars;341176 said:
Heard from a reasonable source that with Senior A gone, that the new North A and South A divisions will only be 8 teams.

Each team will play each other once in a two-day match, and once in a one-day match.
Not far off,

There will be a senior division, North senior 8 sides, south senior , North A 8 sides, South A,North B 10 sides, South B.

Not sure what sides are going were yet as they are still trying to work out were to put the central sides.

Any new clubs that come in will go to North B which could be a few.
 

7/564

Member
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

New points system sounds like a winner.

VTCA have done a great job putting this together, you would think a couple off things might need to be sorted out but nothing major.

rumour has it that there may not be a money limit which will help the clubs that have been doing the right thing.

Points system is easier to control than you can only pay 2 players( which we no alot off clubs pay more than 2).

So my opion which dose not count for much haha, Is thumps up to VTCA and it should make it an even competion over the next few years.

One more thing which i think is good. NO club will l have to get rid off any players that they had this year
 

fencesitter

New Member
Re: North A & B

jika jika;340968 said:
clubs based nearest to the city, eg: MHSOB, rpb, Youlden, Port Melb, Willy CY's, Maccarbi may swing between nth & sth to keep basic structure sound. You can't start Senior Div with an even 6 and 6 or along with Doutta you relegate OEG, Altona Nth to the north, dont promote 3 of the 4 finalists from Senior A ( St B, Willy, Hoppers) because they are northern based keep Hampton up (who finished below OEG and AN) and promote teams that finished 3, 5, 6 (brighton, maccarbi, and Beumauris) from senior A because they are south based. Good luck selling that idea
I agree ,but starting Senior 10-2 will forever leave a big discrepincey with Nth/Sth. Will be interesting to see what they come up with.
8 teams per div with 7 two-dayers n 7 one-dayers is a great idea in my opinion, although im sure not all will agree.
 

southern sledge

Active Member
Re: North A & B

It would mean a South team would come in every year and if McKinnon and South Caulfield stay out of the bottom 2 spots it means 2 North clubs would go down and the South teams would increase their numbers in Senior Div. The 8 team divisions is a great idea as 10 team divisions are unfair.
 

fencesitter

New Member
Re: North A & B

southern sledge;341233 said:
It would mean a South team would come in every year and if McKinnon and South Caulfield stay out of the bottom 2 spots it means 2 North clubs would go down and the South teams would increase their numbers in Senior Div. The 8 team divisions is a great idea as 10 team divisions are unfair.
Not a bad idea SS , probably too good an idea for the vtca to apply.
Would be funny if Mckinnon do finish in the bottom 2 next year though.
If it does happen ,that would mean 2 nth sides from an 8 side division would get relegated which would be harsh.
 
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

I think the whole idea of the splitting up of Senior A is a good one although things have been made harder to manage due to the fact Senior Div is lop sided with North than South side teams.Thats going to take the most working out with teams obviously going to be upset and others on the other hand not.
Is this just a forum idea or are the VTCA actually looking at these suggestions?
 
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

underarm bowler;341451 said:
I think the whole idea of the splitting up of Senior A is a good one although things have been made harder to manage due to the fact Senior Div is lop sided with North than South side teams.Thats going to take the most working out with teams obviously going to be upset and others on the other hand not.
Is this just a forum idea or are the VTCA actually looking at these suggestions?
At recent Presidents/Secretaries meetings held in both North and South, the idea was discussed at length by clubs representation and VTCA Exec. Also at recent Finals meetings the topic was mentioned by Exec members as being discussed at present. You would imagine given the time of year that an announcement will be expected Presentation night, if not before.
 

7/564

Member
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

Not Just Empty Words;341476 said:
At recent Presidents/Secretaries meetings held in both North and South, the idea was discussed at length by clubs representation and VTCA Exec. Also at recent Finals meetings the topic was mentioned by Exec members as being discussed at present. You would imagine given the time of year that an announcement will be expected Presentation night, if not before.
95% gone
 

jika jika

Member
Re: North A & B

fencesitter;341300 said:
Not a bad idea SS , probably too good an idea for the vtca to apply.
Would be funny if Mckinnon do finish in the bottom 2 next year though.
If it does happen ,that would mean 2 nth sides from an 8 side division would get relegated which would be harsh.
Senior div will be 12 sides, not 8. Whoever gets relegated from senior div next year , whether it be 2 north or not, the teams in the top north and south divisions will be shuffled to make it as fair as possible travel wise. eg: If MHSOB are in the top north division and are not premiers or don't finish last they may swap to south division to accomadate 2 north sides coming back. Think your being harsh on the Exec of the vtca, they seem to be very proactive at the moment with points system and grade restructure. Some new blood has come on board so lets see what they can do.
 

jacko66

Member
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

Jike, the clear thinking, articulate, diplomat! I've got to agree with everything you've said in this thread. It all sounds like common sense to me.

Now, what happens to the senior 2nds?

In the 8 team comps, where there will be a whole round of 1 dayers, the opportunity should be taken to introduce bowling restrictions.
 
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

jacko66;341692 said:
Jike, the clear thinking, articulate, diplomat! I've got to agree with everything you've said in this thread. It all sounds like common sense to me.

Now, what happens to the senior 2nds?

In the 8 team comps, where there will be a whole round of 1 dayers, the opportunity should be taken to introduce bowling restrictions.
We dont have batting restrictions, so why should there be bowling restrictions ?
How fair is it to a side that has a Professional or overseas player who is specifically at the club and paid to bowl, he is limited in his effectivness. But yet a batsmen brought to the club has no restrictions on his potential performance and contribution....
 
Re: Possible breakup of Senior A into North & South divisions

Not Just Empty Words;341704 said:
We dont have batting restrictions, so why should there be bowling restrictions ?
How fair is it to a side that has a Professional or overseas player who is specifically at the club and paid to bowl, he is limited in his effectivness. But yet a batsmen brought to the club has no restrictions on his potential performance and contribution....
So what your saying is you don't agree with the proposed rules that District cricket, state cricket, county cricket and international cricket already use?

Imagine Australia playing India in the World Cup final and each batsman had to retire at 50! :eek::eek:
 
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