Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

Had my first match in just under ten years today, read the full story here

I bowled what turned out to be the final over, which is the first time I've EVER bowled in a match. I'd been offered the end with a following wind but turned it down, then later got to bowl with a headwind. My bowling was so-so - I was pitching it too far down, and my over was pretty expensive, but I'm fairly happy with it all things considered. Hell, I wasn't even bowling leg-spin until three months ago. The really good thing is I did get one batsman, who'd been in for several overs, to edge the ball to the keeper, although it's a shame he then dropped it... Anyway, it's just the encouragement I needed and since I'm unlikely to be available for the next couple of matches I should be able to get some practise in before the next time I play and hopefully get that wicket!

Today's stats: 0.4 overs, 0 maidens, 0 wickets, 14 runs, 1 wide (4,4,1,+,4)

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

do you think I am using enough shoulder, which are the injuries leg spinners get and I do not feel any torque or get sore shoulder.

The more you get the front knee up and rock back the stronger the front shoulder becomes. Like I said it's not a fatal flaw in your action just a small adjustment really but if you try the exercise I described before you will feel the extra power in the left shoulder available.

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

Had my first match in just under ten years today, read the full story here

I bowled what turned out to be the final over, which is the first time I've EVER bowled in a match. I'd been offered the end with a following wind but turned it down, then later got to bowl with a headwind. My bowling was so-so - I was pitching it too far down, and my over was pretty expensive, but I'm fairly happy with it all things considered. Hell, I wasn't even bowling leg-spin until three months ago. The really good thing is I did get one batsman, who'd been in for several overs, to edge the ball to the keeper, although it's a shame he then dropped it... Anyway, it's just the encouragement I needed and since I'm unlikely to be available for the next couple of matches I should be able to get some practise in before the next time I play and hopefully get that wicket!

Today's stats: 0.4 overs, 0 maidens, 0 wickets, 14 runs, 1 wide (4,4,1,+,4)

You went so close to getting a scalp in your very first outing it's such a shame the keeper let you down.

 

[Jim2109]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

out of interest, how many of us on here took a wicket in our first ever over? i got one with my 3rd ball. their opening bat who had scored all their runs got stumped in about the 17th over of a T20 match. and youve got to bear in mind that my bowling was pretty awful at that stage. i was bowling off of no run up, with no front arm whatsoever and no follow through.

it just seems to be a weird coincidence that most leg spinners (even complete novices like myself at that time) seem to either take a wicket, or have a chance wasted, in their first ever over. at least thats the case with the few that ive spoken to about it. just wondering if anyone else managed it?

i wonder if its because egotistical batsmen see the lack of confidence in the new bowler, and think "im going to smash this guy", but underestimate the fact that most novice bowlers overflight the ball, and even badly bowled legspin with lots of flight can be deadly if you try to overplay it.

in my first match my first 2 balls were uncalled wides. they were miles outside off stump but the umpire (an opposing batsman none-the-less!) knew it was my first match so he let me have them as "looseners" lol. the batsman up the other end figured "this kid is useless, im smashing him next ball", and i bowled an absolute cherry that drifted and turned on him as he came down the wicket and he got stumped about 2 yards out lol. ive never bowled another delivery in a match situation anywhere near as good as that. but then ive had 7 months more development since that, so in theory i should be much more potent this season if i ever get a game.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

You went so close to getting a scalp in your very first outing it's such a shame the keeper let you down.

To be fair to him it wasn't an easy catch, down low and to his right, and don't think he's a full-time keeper anyway. The main thing is I had the batsman in trouble, and that gives me great confidence going forward. I know if I just keep practising I'll get wickets sooner or later, so even if I was a tad unlucky yesterday it's a case of "the harder I work, the luckier I'll get..."

 

[SteveyD]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

it sounds retarded, but sometimes they just lack the technique to even lose their wicket.

you can only bowl what is in front of you though, and to be a truly good player you have to learn to deal with that

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

To be fair to him it wasn't an easy catch, down low and to his right, and don't think he's a full-time keeper anyway. The main thing is I had the batsman in trouble, and that gives me great confidence going forward. I know if I just keep practising I'll get wickets sooner or later, so even if I was a tad unlucky yesterday it's a case of "the harder I work, the luckier I'll get..."

Yeah I should'nt talk, i'm a hopeless glovesman. It is hard to keep to legspin. Makes a huge difference when you get someone with some real talent behind the stumps, they hardly miss a chance and sometimes perform miracles.

It's just if he had held it you would have been an instant legend. Or cop some "beginners luck" stick. Not a bad strike rate though so far, 4 balls one dropped catch.

 

[Jim2109]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

you can only bowl what is in front of you though, and to be a truly good player you have to learn to deal with that

or just get yourself promoted to a higher standard of cricket lol

 

[shrek]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

I had a quick butchers on Amazon.co.uk and it doesn't look like it's available here in blighty, but I'm definitely interested in it - do you know if it's soft on the outside? Yeah it's not available here in the UK - here's another reason we struggle against your lot in cricket - we get ropier gear while you lot get all the top notch stuff!!!!!

I looked at it and a couple of others and i had to go for a cheaper one which was available here
Amazon.com: Pro Impact Sports - Poly Soft PVC Cricket Ball: Sports & Outdoors
Waiting on the mailman to bring it to me.

On the other hand, I found these on the uk amazon website:

UPFRONT Incrediball training cricket ball for practice ORANGE, Adult: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Leisure

Gray-Nicolls Wonderball Cricket Ball Red: Amazon.co.uk: Sports & Leisure

Have fun I say

 

[shrek]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

out of interest, how many of us on here took a wicket in our first ever over? i got one with my 3rd ball. their opening bat who had scored all their runs got stumped in about the 17th over of a T20 match. and youve got to bear in mind that my bowling was pretty awful at that stage. i was bowling off of no run up, with no front arm whatsoever and no follow through.

it just seems to be a weird coincidence that most leg spinners (even complete novices like myself at that time) seem to either take a wicket, or have a chance wasted, in their first ever over. at least thats the case with the few that ive spoken to about it. just wondering if anyone else managed it?

i wonder if its because egotistical batsmen see the lack of confidence in the new bowler, and think "im going to smash this guy", but underestimate the fact that most novice bowlers overflight the ball, and even badly bowled legspin with lots of flight can be deadly if you try to overplay it.

in my first match my first 2 balls were uncalled wides. they were miles outside off stump but the umpire (an opposing batsman none-the-less!) knew it was my first match so he let me have them as "looseners" lol. the batsman up the other end figured "this kid is useless, im smashing him next ball", and i bowled an absolute cherry that drifted and turned on him as he came down the wicket and he got stumped about 2 yards out lol. ive never bowled another delivery in a match situation anywhere near as good as that. but then ive had 7 months more development since that, so in theory i should be much more potent this season if i ever get a game.

The first over I bowled in a match with a leather ball (ever ) was in India when I got carted for 10 runs. To be fair, I was 13 and bowled 4 fulltosses, didnt know why the ball would topspin rather than leg spin.

10 years forth to last year when I bowled my first spell here in the US, I got a wicket in my first over - best batsman on the team caught at long off. And then, one each in the next two overs. One off a full-toss that the batsman tried to swipe at, missed and was caught plumb in front ).

The second match I bowled, I got another wicket in my first over (this one was a semifinal ), caught at slip trying to cut.

But in the next match, I had a southpaw's catch put down at midwicket (dolly!!) in my first over, was taken for 7 runs and didn't bowl the rest of the season.

PS: I also tend to get wickets regularly off full tosses - believe it has something to do with the dip

 

[SteveyD]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

I had a quick butchers on Amazon.co.uk and it doesn't look like it's available here in blighty, but I'm definitely interested in it - do you know if it's soft on the outside? Yeah it's not available here in the UK - here's another reason we struggle against your lot in cricket - we get ropier gear while you lot get all the top notch stuff!!!!!

Those balls that are linked later all fall apart on concrete, we used to practise on a basketball court.
So far the best we have found are these :
ND Cricket Soft Wind Ball Plastic Orange Windball 6PACK on eBay (end time 05-May-10 15:51:43 BST)
They have a moulded seam and arn't made by joining two pieces together like the others. The others are two pieces with a baloon inside, which the outside rips then the baloon pops out and bursts.

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

The point of the Aussie ball is that it's the full 5.5 oz, all these others although okay for practicing are not the full weight. I don't suppose the Aussie ball is any good on concrete it'll be fine on grass and articficial surfaces?

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

Keith Stackpole showed a bit of talent as a legspinner. In fact in 1966 the Australian Prime Minister, Bob Menzies paid to send Stacky to Adelaide to take private lessons from Grimmett.

Clarrie asked Stackpole to meet him at the Adelaide Oval for his first lesson. It was the middle of the football season so when the student arrived for his session he noticed there was no pitch of course. Perhaps they would work in the inddor nets. But no, Old Grum had a some tape, a tape measure and some stumps and marked out a wicket.

Then he took out a pair of scissors and cut out a piece of cardboard 10" square. He then placed the card a few yards from the batting crease on the line of leg stump. Then Grimmett put a blindfold over his eyes and skipped in and bowled the ball, which Stackpole said in his autobiography landed right on the card and hit the top of off stump.

Grimmett, who was then 75 years of age, walked up to his pupil and told him "that's your first lesson son, if you want to be any good that's what you have to be able to do"

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

If I am batting against a legspinner and their is a strong crossbreeze from cover I know his legbreaks will drift with the wind and perhaps drop from some overspin. If the wind is strong and the spin hard the drift can be alarming and even hypnotic. I open my stance a little to get both eyes on it and can see the drift. This line of sight can help detect the drop as well.

But when a topspinner is bowled straight at you into a strong headwind the ball can drop a lot shorter than what seems likely at first. The problem for a batsman is this shortfall of the ball is so hard to detect. That is why the topspinner is such an important ball to the legspinner and should be the first variation learnt and mastered.

 

[mr bojangles]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

First game of the season was on Sunday. Friendly warm up against a local club. From a personal perspective I had quite a good game although my team lost narrowly in the end.

Batting-wise I was a bit scratchy but hung around for 20 overs and was starting to time the ball quite well in the end. Made 35 – which for my first innings of the year I was pretty happy with.

Bowling was very much a ‘game of two halves’ so to speak. I got to bowl 4 overs but came on to bowl at the death against batsmen who were swinging at everything.

In my first over I got two wickets – one guy storming down the pitch, heaving across the line and being clean bowled (pitching middle and leg, hitting off) and another one nicking a ball wide of the off stump into the hands of slip. A two wicket maiden. I couldn’t have dreamt of a better start to my season.

Sadly it was downhill from then on – the batsmen carried on playing their shots and started to connect. I was belted for three 4s and an almighty 6 (across the line to cow corner) in the next over. The following over was almost as painful (10 runs) and I found myself bowling flatter and faster as a response to being carted around.

I salvaged a little bit of pride in my last over with a dropped catch (albeit on the boundary travelling at 100mph) and a couple of dot balls but my confidence was pretty shot at this point. Sad to say I was glad to get taken off in the end.

Final figures – 4 overs, 2 wickets, 33 runs.

Looking back I know I should have kept to my game plan – flighted the ball up and waited for the batsmen to make mistakes. In the end I let my head drop once the boundaries started to flow and didn’t really have a plan ‘B’ other than to bowl faster without much spin to try and stem the flow of runs (which didn’t work either!!)

Having slept on things I’m satisfied enough with my performance – I’m on a steep learning curve at the moment and it was a new experience to bowl at the death against very hostile batting. In this context my final figures weren’t too bad. I think it was the experience in my final three overs when I started to panic and didn’t know what to do that slightly soured my performance.

If the two wicket maiden had come in the 4th rather than the 1st over I’d have walked away on a real high – as it is I think I can take some positives out of the experience. I just hope my captain remembers the wickets rather than the boundaries!!

 

[Jim2109]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

dont see getting hit for a boundary as a negative. an aggressive batsman is usually a reckless batsman. especially if they come at you endlessly and dont simply pick you off on odd deliveries. if they are determined to score runs off every delivery then its only ever a matter of time before they misjudge one.

the key is to keep your head and bowl to your plan, which is obviously where you went wrong this weekend, but its the natural response, you just have to fight it.

there is no hard and fast rule on how to bowl at sloggers as every one does it differently. i think ive developed some pretty solid methods in the nets this pre season to handle players of all sorts of aggressive techniques. the only ones i dont have an answer for yet are the ones that dont actually slog the ball, but play shots with proper form using their feet rather than their arms to smash you around.

everyone else however might as well hold up a sign saying where they want me to put the ball. you can read the exact shot they plan to play from their body language, and you can also read where they want it to pitch. for example, my stock line is on leg stump on an average length with good bounce. the batsman is likely to drop deep in his crease and step away from the stumps to free himself up for a massive pull shot. he will usually show his intent in his stance, or sometimes they are even stupid enough to take their guard in the position they intend to finish!! my answer to this would be to bowl really full at his legs with a backspun leg break, mostly just to cramp his shot. id set the field strong between square leg and mid wicket to cover off the shot in case he still digs it out.

the 2nd most fun players are the ones that wish they had footwork, but really dont, and want to charge you every ball. the really bad ones will get stumped all day long, just bowl faster and shorter at their legs, theyll have to play across the line coming down the wicket, miss the ball, and when it then turns back past their pads theyll get stumped. the less retarded ones need a little more respect, but i still like to drop the ball short to them. if they are coming down the wicket its because they want to meet the ball full, so give them the opposite of what they want! il usually bowl slower at these batsmen as well to enable maximum turn and hope for a mistimed shot. the best scenario is where they get forwards by a stride really early, start their swing and then have to check it as they realise its slow and short, and then their only remaining option is defence or stupidity. if they miss the ball theyre still getting stumped. this only works if you read them charging. if you bowl this ball and they stay back then youll get creamed!!

left handers are even more fun!! bowl at their legs with packed leg side fields. after a few deliveries when they try to free up space on the off side (by stepping away) bowl one well outside off stump with men at deep cover point, point, slip and gully. if youve got a wrong'un then use that as well. dont worry if its a wide, most batsmen will try and hit it anyway! if they dont take the bait and still want to free up the off side then bowl a straight one at middle stump as fast as you can.

as for the number 1 most fun aggressive batsmen to bowl at? idiots who think the switch hit is a worthwhile shot to have in your armoury!! even Kevin Pietersen struggles to make it work, he used it once to great effect because no-one expected it. Graeme Swann was the same, the first time he did it he caught people by surprise. people expect it now so its harder to pull off. club batsmen just arent patient enough, they always switch their hands or start to move their feet prior to ball release. so i see them coming a mile off. then i change my line to outside leg stump and very full (to right handers) so that when they are then in their leftie position theyre forced to get bat on ball or they are clean bowled. i did it the other day in nets (but dropped it a bit shorter than intended) and got the ball to turn back so far that it hit "off stump" (now leg stump) behind his legs, via his flailing glove. all day long mate. nothing makes a batsman look more stupid, i cant wait for someone to try it in a match!!

 

[macca]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

First game of the season was on Sunday. Friendly warm up against a local club. From a personal perspective I had quite a good game although my team lost narrowly in the end.

Batting-wise I was a bit scratchy but hung around for 20 overs and was starting to time the ball quite well in the end. Made 35 – which for my first innings of the year I was pretty happy with.

Bowling was very much a ‘game of two halves’ so to speak. I got to bowl 4 overs but came on to bowl at the death against batsmen who were swinging at everything.

In my first over I got two wickets – one guy storming down the pitch, heaving across the line and being clean bowled (pitching middle and leg, hitting off) and another one nicking a ball wide of the off stump into the hands of slip. A two wicket maiden. I couldn’t have dreamt of a better start to my season.

Sadly it was downhill from then on – the batsmen carried on playing their shots and started to connect. I was belted for three 4s and an almighty 6 (across the line to cow corner) in the next over. The following over was almost as painful (10 runs) and I found myself bowling flatter and faster as a response to being carted around.

I salvaged a little bit of pride in my last over with a dropped catch (albeit on the boundary travelling at 100mph) and a couple of dot balls but my confidence was pretty shot at this point. Sad to say I was glad to get taken off in the end.

Final figures – 4 overs, 2 wickets, 33 runs.

Looking back I know I should have kept to my game plan – flighted the ball up and waited for the batsmen to make mistakes. In the end I let my head drop once the boundaries started to flow and didn’t really have a plan ‘B’ other than to bowl faster without much spin to try and stem the flow of runs (which didn’t work either!!)

Having slept on things I’m satisfied enough with my performance – I’m on a steep learning curve at the moment and it was a new experience to bowl at the death against very hostile batting. In this context my final figures weren’t too bad. I think it was the experience in my final three overs when I started to panic and didn’t know what to do that slightly soured my performance.

If the two wicket maiden had come in the 4th rather than the 1st over I’d have walked away on a real high – as it is I think I can take some positives out of the experience. I just hope my captain remembers the wickets rather than the boundaries!!

Bill Clinton used to say " its the economy,stupid " well in legspin its the exact opposite, its the wickets.

You couldn't hope for a better start. Something always happens when you bring on the legspinners either runs or wickets or both.

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

I like Macca's comments at the end, I played against a team with a Mouthy wicket keeper come batsman who was making snide comments re playing against Leg-spin as I started my overs, I'll tell you about it later once I've written it up in my main blog.

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

Jim you're either full of it or you're very clever bowler and I've got a feeling you're the latter!!!

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Wrist Spin Bowling (Part Three)

Here's a question for Macca and anyone else that advocates the throwing of the ball up against a wall underarm as practice. If you do this with the Leg break where are you expecting to see it spin, because when I'm doing it the ball spins and forces the ball in a very steep downwards direction - is that right?