All time world xi

[courtjester]

All time world xi

Yeh, I'm bored. Let's debate, nicely!

All Time World XI

1. Sunil Gavaskar (Ind)
2. Jack Hobbs (Eng)
3. Don Bradman (Aus)
4. Wally Hammond (Eng)
5. Viv Richards (WI)
6. Garfield Sobers (WI)
7. Adam Gilchrist (Aus)
8. Wasim Akram (Pak)
9. Shane Warne (Aus)
10. Curtly Ambrose (WI)
11. Dennis Lillee (Aus)

12th. Sachin Tendulkar (Ind)

 

[brickwaller99]

Re: All time world xi

Border, G Chappell, L Hutton, R Lindwall, M Holding, D Tallon, I Khan. Most of them should be in the side.

Ambrose is ridiculous, as is warne and wasim.
Plenty of better openers too.

Keeper depends on whether you want a keeper batsman or the best keeper.

Keith Miller is miles ahead of sobers.

I agree with Bradman that is all.

 

[courtjester]

Re: All time world xi

Border, G Chappell, L Hutton, R Lindwall, M Holding, D Tallon, I Khan. Most of them should be in the side.

Ambrose is ridiculous, as is warne and wasim.
Plenty of better openers too.

Keeper depends on whether you want a keeper batsman or the best keeper.

Keith Miller is miles ahead of sobers.

I agree with Bradman that is all.

Why dont you post your own side then and we can argue their respective merits?

Is Border going to replace Hammond, Richards or Sobers? I wouldn't think so. Same as Chappell, he would come close, but i'd take my three first.

Lindwall and Holding could be argued for, definately. But why say Ambrose is "ridiculous"? Check his figures. The guy was a bowling machine, and had all the attributes I'd want in a quick: pace, accuracy and aggression.

Warne? Ridiculous? Really? Why? Warne is the greatest bowler I have seen. Richie Benaud, who has seen more cricket than you and me, agrees. Warne won games of cricket for Australia that seemed lost. Adelaide Ashes a few years back? He basically forced us to victory. Saying Warne's selection is "ridiculous" must be the strangest thing I've read on these boards.

Plenty of better openers? Who?

Keith Miller is miles ahead of Sobers? Ummm. No. Very different cricketers. Sobers is the second batsman selected in any all-time XI. His bowling and fielding is a bonus. Imran might vie for a place, but I chose not to select him.

I choose Gilchrist because he was a destructive force and I want that aggression in my team. Also, it is a myth that he wasn't a good keeper. He kept to Warne for ten years. He was a great keeper, very tidy.

Wasim is my interesting selection. Man, he was something with the ball, a massive handful in swinging conditions. I like the left arm variety. I could understand someone arguing against him though.

 

[brickwaller99]

Re: All time world xi

mmk
suit yourself

Sid Barnes
L Hutton
DG Bradman - http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/457074.html
W Hammond
G Sobers
K Miller
R Lindwall
D Tallon
M Holding
D Lillee
C Grimmett

12th J Hobbs

Miller and Sobers are very different indeed. Miller is legendary, Sobers is almost legendary, basically only lacking the versatility of Miller who could and would bat anywhere and almost as amazing as sobers, bowl blistering pace, subtle spin, and swing it for good measure.
Miller wins on versatility.

Tendulkar has the lowest average of anyone in the top 5. He is about level with Hobbs and is a personal choice as far as I see. Sobers gets a spot here however instead of tendulkar. Whilst his bowling does not put him into an all time team his batting alone puts him in.

Holding was mesmerising, Lillee look at his figures, Lindwall was rated as the greatest bowler ever by the only person to cover more matches than Richie.
Clarrie Grimmet never bowled a wide in first class cricket at all. 216 wickets in 37 matches which is an average of 1/2 a wicket better than Warne per innings and he also played against two of the batsman from the team and 12th man. Warne played against no one in the team.

Once again the keeper depends on whether you want the best keeper of all time or the best batsman of all time that can wear gloves. Because everyone in the top 6 averages over 55 I went for the best keeper of all time.

That's why Bradman will not be humanly surpassed. Look at the link and compare to the rest of his career. This is what he was capable of.

 

[courtjester]

Re: All time world xi

mmk
suit yourself

Sid Barnes
L Hutton
DG Bradman - http://www.cricinfo.com/magazine/content/story/457074.html
W Hammond
G Sobers
K Miller
R Lindwall
D Tallon
M Holding
D Lillee
C Grimmett

12th J Hobbs

Miller and Sobers are very different indeed. Miller is legendary, Sobers is almost legendary, basically only lacking the versatility of Miller who could and would bat anywhere and almost as amazing as sobers, bowl blistering pace, subtle spin, and swing it for good measure.
Miller wins on versatility.

Um, Sobers is almost legendary? You must set a high standard. And Miller wasn't a spin bowler. It was Sobers who bowled pace, wrist spin and off spin. Miller was a great bowler, but only as a pace bowler.

Holding was mesmerising, Lillee look at his figures, Lindwall was rated as the greatest bowler ever by the only person to cover more matches than Richie..

Your arguments are interesting. Lillee's figures weren't actually as good as a lot of other people. But I choose him as a matchwinner.

Clarrie Grimmet never bowled a wide in first class cricket at all. 216 wickets in 37 matches which is an average of 1/2 a wicket better than Warne per innings and he also played against two of the batsman from the team and 12th man. Warne played against no one in the team..

Fair enough on Grimmett, although it doesnt matter about eras to me. I select Warne in a similar way to Lillee, as a matchwinner.

Once again the keeper depends on whether you want the best keeper of all time or the best batsman of all time that can wear gloves. Because everyone in the top 6 averages over 55 I went for the best keeper of all time...

Just to clarify, Miller doesnt average over 55. And Tallon wasnt the best keeper ever.

 

[macca]

Re: All time world xi

Grimmett famously never bowled a no ball in first class cricket. That was from 1911 to 1941. I don't know about wides I will have to check. He had such accuracy I would not be surprised.

Ashley Mallett wrote in his biography of Grimmett ,"Scarlett", that Clarrie was no-balled for overstepping once and that was a club game. Grimmett told the umpire that "he had just set a new record as an umpire, one that would not be broken!"

 

[macca]

Re: All time world xi

Um, Sobers is almost And Miller wasn't a spin bowler. It was Sobers who bowled pace, wrist spin and off spin. Miller was a great bowler, but only as a pace bowler.

Sort of, he was a talented slow legspinner but not test level. Because he was a much better fast bowler and he lived in an era of great aussie leggies he didn't bowl it much beyond the nets.

Terry Jenner learnt the basics of legspin living in the outback from the Keith Miller instruction comics that used to come in the newspapers

 

[Kram81]

Re: All time world xi

Ambrose is ridiculous, as is warne and wasim.

No, just no..

 

[brickwaller99]

Re: All time world xi

Well, sobers gets in there as a batsman. A bowling average of 30+ does not impress for an all time XI. Miller did indeed bowl whatever the hell he felt like, and got wickets. Once had a sore back so bowled spin all game and got 7?(not certain) wickets for the match.

If Tallon wasn't the best keeper ever who was? McGilvray and Bradman considered him so. Evans would come close but tallon at his prime was unbeatable.

Warne and Grimmet/O'Reilly are too far apart in time to really judge them objectively so that's personal opinion as far as I see. It may have been no-balls but I thought it was wides that grimmett never bowled.

 

[courtjester]

Re: All time world xi

Well, sobers gets in there as a batsman. A bowling average of 30+ does not impress for an all time XI. Miller did indeed bowl whatever the hell he felt like, and got wickets. Once had a sore back so bowled spin all game and got 7?(not certain) wickets for the match..

Sobers is in my team as a batsman. His bowling is a handy bonus.
I figure with Lillee, Ambrose, Akram and Warne bowling, the fifth bowler wont have to do too much.

If Tallon wasn't the best keeper ever who was? McGilvray and Bradman considered him so. Evans would come close but tallon at his prime was unbeatable..

Tallon would be right up there, with Healy, Evans, Engineer and Knott. If I was selecting on pure wicketkeeping ability, I'd take Knott.

Warne and Grimmet/O'Reilly are too far apart in time to really judge them objectively so that's personal opinion as far as I see. It may have been no-balls but I thought it was wides that grimmett never bowled.

Absolutely. No doubting their merits. Does anyone consider Murali for this type of team? I find it interesting that no other countries have had outstanding leggies, but we've had three.

 

[brickwaller99]

Re: All time world xi

Personally I would consider Murali before warne, as a matchwinner, as a wicket taker, for statistics, he beats warne comprehensively. Once again the era difference is for personal opinions.

Keepers are hard to judge as to who is the best. There is nothing recorded as to how many they drop or how many catches that shouldn't be possible were taken. All those are reasonable choices but once again it can only be from anecdotal preconceptions as to the choice.

No other countries have had great legspinners? Kumble, the spin quartet, but it's true that england hasn't really had a great legspinner, neither have South Africa.

 

[Boris]

Re: All time world xi

Sobers is in my team as a batsman. His bowling is a handy bonus.
I figure with Lillee, Ambrose, Akram and Warne bowling, the fifth bowler wont have to do too much.

This just brought up a funny thought in my mind. Who exactly are these guys playing against?

If they are playing the second greatest all time XI, I'm pretty sure that even then they'd be put under some great pressure.

Just a funny thought.

 

[courtjester]

Re: All time world xi

This just brought up a funny thought in my mind. Who exactly are these guys playing against?

If they are playing the second greatest all time XI, I'm pretty sure that even then they'd be put under some great pressure.

Just a funny thought.

Good one Boris. They're playing against:

Herb Sutcliffe
Gordon Greenidge
George Headley
Sachin Tendulkar
Greg Chappell
Ricky Ponting
Imran Khan
Allan Knott
Bill O'Reilly
Malcolm Marshall
Michael Holding