Competition audit/discussion

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Re: Competition audit/discussion

Your logic is sound but to me there is one big problem.

The sim changes character with each different pc.

I think this is because of the rnd() function. As you know, it is a string/loop and not a random number.

I've seen this happen may times, in fact one season an admin simmed every game until finals. Handed sim over and the top teams suddenly got thrashed.


Do that and players get pissed off. It is natural for odd upsets, but you need a bit of realism.

However, I do agree with the sim being passed to someone like Mas Cambios after every sim. Just so that if an admin goes awol then we can suffer the problems mentioned above and the competition continues. But it's only as a last resort.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

im a check everyday and post when needed kinda bloke

ill be more then happy too get active and help make the comp stronger ;)
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Frodo27;381152 said:
Your logic is sound but to me there is one big problem.

The sim changes character with each different pc.

I think this is because of the rnd() function. As you know, it is a string/loop and not a random number.

I've seen this happen may times, in fact one season an admin simmed every game until finals. Handed sim over and the top teams suddenly got thrashed.


Do that and players get pissed off. It is natural for odd upsets, but you need a bit of realism.

However, I do agree with the sim being passed to someone like Mas Cambios after every sim. Just so that if an admin goes awol then we can suffer the problems mentioned above and the competition continues. But it's only as a last resort.
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I always thought it was a random number tbh. Never knew this.


But yeah, as Kshitiz said, you NEED multiple simmers. The comp went to shit as soon as Kshitiz left really - not blaming him at all. It was my fault, and it was because I couldn't handle the workload. A simmer for FC cricket and another for OD cricket is a MUST.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

I actually enjoyed doing it over on bigfooty, but the season was often disrupted due to cirumstances beyond my control ;) Dont think thats a problem over here, would be happy to help out if needed

I like the idea of playing each team only once home and away, shorter seasons can help keep interest of teams struggling knowing it doesnt drag on

I would also be in favour of set game days, but how to factor in one day and test games without taking 2 weeks for each round I dont know.

Other way would be a timed round, so whilst you would have set days it wouldnt correlate to a day of the week, a 10 day program could look like

Day 1 one day thread goes up, day 3 match played, day 4 test thread, day 6 test begins

The advantage of having a set program is the simmer doesnt have to fight off calls for simming :D Plus captains know exactly when they are expected to have a team and pitch named every round, sometimes a captain might check, see nothing and not come back for a couple of days for whatever reason and the game has begun

I would also say look at someone to be in charge of match threads, by having set dates they know when it needs to go up

A comp like this due to us all having lives that takes precedence needs more than 1 person. The logistics may make it hard to have more than 1 simmer, but other helpers are handy and someone the simmer can email the program or even comm/scores files if going to be away to
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Frodo27;381152 said:
Your logic is sound but to me there is one big problem.

The sim changes character with each different pc.

I think this is because of the rnd() function. As you know, it is a string/loop and not a random number.

I've seen this happen may times, in fact one season an admin simmed every game until finals. Handed sim over and the top teams suddenly got thrashed.


Do that and players get pissed off. It is natural for odd upsets, but you need a bit of realism.

However, I do agree with the sim being passed to someone like Mas Cambios after every sim. Just so that if an admin goes awol then we can suffer the problems mentioned above and the competition continues. But it's only as a last resort.
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Don't really know what is used in QuickBasic so I have no idea how the random function in it works. Will find out and let everyone know. But sometimes those kind of upsets do really happen.

Anyways, in CS09 I've made it a random number generator definitely. :D And mine isn't affected by different PC's because I use the current time as a seed for the generator. EDIT - Just checked, the time function in C++ somehow reports the number of seconds passed since 1970 or somewhere closer [Birth of Unix?] even in Windows, so on every sim the seed is different, therefore the random numbers are different. :)

Eddiessmith pointed one good thing though. We can have some one as a reserve for putting up match threads, or in fact just have one dedicated person putting up match threads so that the load is off the simmer a bit more.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

eddiesmith;381170 said:
I actually enjoyed doing it over on bigfooty, but the season was often disrupted due to cirumstances beyond my control ;) Dont think thats a problem over here, would be happy to help out if needed

I like the idea of playing each team only once home and away, shorter seasons can help keep interest of teams struggling knowing it doesnt drag on

I would also be in favour of set game days, but how to factor in one day and test games without taking 2 weeks for each round I dont know.

Other way would be a timed round, so whilst you would have set days it wouldnt correlate to a day of the week, a 10 day program could look like

Day 1 one day thread goes up, day 3 match played, day 4 test thread, day 6 test begins

The advantage of having a set program is the simmer doesnt have to fight off calls for simming :D Plus captains know exactly when they are expected to have a team and pitch named every round, sometimes a captain might check, see nothing and not come back for a couple of days for whatever reason and the game has begun

I would also say look at someone to be in charge of match threads, by having set dates they know when it needs to go up
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We have been discussing this in the admin section. Personally, I'm in favour of a 4 week rotation where you have 3 weeks of tests, followed up by the 3 corresponding one day games.

Weeks 1-3 would work like this:

Friday - New game thread (tests)
Monday - Deadline for teams
Tuesday - Thursday - Match is posted (tests)

Then week 4 (one day games) would be:

Friday - Game thread with warning of 3 games to be played.

Monday - Game 1 plus game thread for next game up

Wednesday - Game 2 plus game thread for next game

Friday - Game 3 (plus thread up for the next test)

Yes, it's a little bit of a rush for the one day games but the idea is that playing in those games is a reward for quality posting/participation in the test side of things.

Also, there would be three weeks to people to put their case forward in dedicated one day threads.

Obviously the onus is on the captain to get teams in etc but he can nominate to play the same side for all three games or leave selection to a vice captain etc.

As for tests, well, it gives close to four days to make a selection.

On the upside, it's easy to plan a schedule for and it means that you get three 'match' days every week. A twenty20 tournament can also be slotted in, if needed.

I'm also in favour of a shorter season (to begin with) with home and away followed by a best of 3 final.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

I'm not really going to be the one using it, so it is really up to the players and simmers. However, I really don't think you can have a system where there is only one game day per week.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Good work Mas

The 4 week system will fail due to the OD's

I found it too much to do two a week,three will almost certainly fall over.

Almost the same work for a OD as a test.


ps

For any given initial seed, the same number sequence is generated because each successive call to the Rnd function uses the previous number as a seed for the next number in the sequence.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

I'm not being funny here but can you explain in terms of workload?

I've only ever dabbled with the sim, running a game here and there. I've never edited teams etc so I haven't got a clue what that entails but in terms of actually simming the games it was just a case of letting it run and then copying the score/comm files.

If we are to get this working then as much info as possible would help.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Okay........this is my process.

1) Create main folder for sim of each game type

2) Create 5 subfolders for each game. (2 for this league)

3) set up initial teams in Cricsim

That sets up the competition

4) post game thread

5) alter teams as per posted side.

6) Copy sim to folder one (so if you stuff up you have a backup)

7) sim game one

8) check stats to ensure it was a good sim

9) open COMM.text copy & paste game

10) open SCORE.txt copy and paste game

11) copy directory to folder two

12) repeat 7~11 for each game

13) Produce ladder

14) post ladder

15) Copy stats to notepad

16) paste stats to board

17) deal with signings and delistings

18) deal with PM's and player comments / whinges


Also, remember this. As said before, captains have their real lives as well as fantasy ones. To be a good captain you need to work out the best side. That takes time. You also need to have enough time before, during and after a game for banter.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

In regards to season length, I think the old model can be pretty good, especially if you're using T20 in between the season (Not sure if that's the best idea).

Mon - Fri - Test Matches

T20 threads go up on Thursday
OD threads go up on Friday

T20 match on saturday
Test Match threads go up on Saturday

OD Match on Sunday

Might be too hectic though. My suggestion would be a T20 league, maybe in between the break between two different seasons (Like right now) or a mid season break? And then have the league structure,

Mon - Fri - Test matches
OD threads go up on Fri

Test threads go up on Saturday

OD match on Sunday,
Test Match on Monday for the new week again.

And keep it to 10 Rounds I think, for 5 teams i.e
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Frodo said:
8) check stats to ensure it was a good sim
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I'm confused here. What does this mean?

Also, with multiple simmers, it can go like this.

Option no. 1 - Have two simmers, one for OD's and one for Tests. Both can have their own seperate copies, to rule out the sim changing character thing. And for the rest instructions like how to organize games and posting after every round, I think I have a detailed post somewhere in the Cricsim mods forum or the general mods forum, and I think Mas can pick it up and post here. :)

Option no. 2 - Have four or more simmers, and divide league games evenly. Say there are 5 simmers, and 10 rounds, so give each simmer 2 rounds to deal with. Again, for the sim changing character thing, its all balanced out.

There are many ways around. One just has to think which one suits best.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Kshitiz;381216 said:
I'm confused here. What does this mean?

Also, with multiple simmers, it can go like this.

Option no. 1 - Have two simmers, one for OD's and one for Tests. Both can have their own separate copies, to rule out the sim changing character thing. And for the rest instructions like how to organize games and posting after every round, I think I have a detailed post somewhere in the Cricsim mods forum or the general mods forum, and I think Mas can pick it up and post here. :)

Option no. 2 - Have four or more simmers, and divide league games evenly. Say there are 5 simmers, and 10 rounds, so give each simmer 2 rounds to deal with. Again, for the sim changing character thing, its all balanced out.

There are many ways around. One just has to think which one suits best.
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It means you check if it is good. You see, if you have copied for backup there are a number of sims on the pc. Maybe you accidentally sim the wrong sim ( an older one), you know how many you simmed, so the league in the stats confirms it.


Option 1 is good, in fact very good. The problem is the time. A compromise would be that weeks 1~3 are tests. That is good and simple for all. Week 4 is OD's or 20/20, but not fixed numbers of games. Maybe at the start it can be 3 days, but if not it carries over to the next week 4. So maybe that means the tests finish first, have the finals, and then complete the OD's and finals. Not a bad solution and gives flexibility.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Frodo27;381217 said:
It means you check if it is good. You see, if you have copied for backup there are a number of sims on the pc. Maybe you accidentally sim the wrong sim ( an older one), you know how many you simmed, so the league in the stats confirms it.


Option 1 is good, in fact very good. The problem is the time. A compromise would be that weeks 1~3 are tests. That is good and simple for all. Week 4 is OD's or 20/20, but not fixed numbers of games. Maybe at the start it can be 3 days, but if not it carries over to the next week 4. So maybe that means the tests finish first, have the finals, and then complete the OD's and finals. Not a bad solution and gives flexibility.
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Yeah that is good, if it is fine with the simmers. But they'll need to be sure of a pretty good amount of time, like say 3 weeks, to commit to simming.

On the other hand, in the 1 test 1 OD system, if someone is out, we can sim another test match till he's back or another OD's etc., and then catchup later. This way, no hangups in the season.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

Kshitiz;381221 said:
On the other hand, in the 1 test 1 OD system, if someone is out, we can sim another test match till he's back or another OD's etc., and then catchup later. This way, no hangups in the season.
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Which is where it all goes to pot. Trust me, for this to work you need a set schedule.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

mas cambios;381255 said:
Which is where it all goes to pot. Trust me, for this to work you need a set schedule.
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I know, but its very problematic to stick to a schedule throughout the season without missing anything, considering the fact that "people have lives outside" and of course unless its a full time paid job.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

I really don't get all this stuff about how much time it takes. We have 4 teams, that two games to sim. Does it really take that much time to sim?

Having a fixed schedule makes it easier. People know where they are and what is expected. Most of the problems at the moment is down to people never knowing where the season is at and where the next set of games is coming.
 
Re: Competition audit/discussion

mas cambios;381265 said:
I really don't get all this stuff about how much time it takes. We have 4 teams, that two games to sim. Does it really take that much time to sim?

Having a fixed schedule makes it easier. People know where they are and what is expected. Most of the problems at the moment is down to people never knowing where the season is at and where the next set of games is coming.
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Mas is spot on, games would go up on a Monday teams named Tuesday game simmed 3 weeks later!! We need a schedule to let people know when the games will be simmed. I have been playing with the sim and its not hard at all. Once the teams are in the sim does the rest. I do have 1 question when I'm simming a game say 50 overs it gets to 38 or so and stops, can anyone tell me what I'm doing wrong?

I think if we are going to spend time recruiting players we need to get this right. If all mods can bring 3 or 4 new faces half our problems will be solved.
 
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