Test XI Selection Thread
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CLOCKER
Active Member
Once the tour is over they really need to get rid of Arthur and replace him with Lehman. Clarke cannot continue as a selector and the fact that he covets the role suggests that he is a control freak and uses it as a way to wield his authority. Clearly not working with Hussey retiring (prematurely), and the others not being bothered to do their homework and continued rumors of discontent. They cannot continue with Smith & Henriques in the same team, as they cannot have Watson and Warner in the same team. Warner will struggle in England as will Hughes and Smith. The only trouble is that not to many batsmen putting up their hand in the Sheffield Shield. With all the various academies Australia has I don't think I have seen Australian cricket at such a low ebb. Spotlight needs to be put on all of these coaches.
nairbe
Active Member
Why? is the theory of replace the leader the only way we know? it seems to be the ethos of the time and it is a failure. to build a strong team we need to endure and that will not be gained by change for the sake of it. we need to be patient and accept that the team has much to learn and gain through the experience of loosing. They are battling through adversity and from that they will learn. Enjoy the experience of growth before you bask in the light of glory. the up coming Ashes will be a lesson in pain if you have no vision for the future.
CLOCKER
Active Member
If you mean Arthur, he is not a leader and not upto the job. Openly talking about Hussey coming back.Then sucking upto Watson after pretending they were taking no more crap.Talk about mixed messages.The players who have done everything asked of them must be wondering what the hell is going on. No doubt Clarke should be captain but not a selector. Lehman has been in the system for a while and knows the Australian better than most.Is Khawaja finished as a Test player? Not selected again. If his attitude is not right then send him home, but to have him sit there for 4 Tests tells me the selectors picked him for the tour and had no idea about him or he has seriously pi**sed of a lot of people on tour. We need middle order bats and forget this allrounder experiment. Pattinson and Starc have shown that they can bat and will probably have better averages than some of the batsmen.Smith has played well against the spin but his technique against the seaming ball will be found out in England. Henriques is in the same boat.
We have 10 Tests against the Poms. You may be right about growth etc etc, but if the Poms beat us 7-0 there are going to be a lot of people looking for new jobs at CA. The weather may be the only saving grace for the Aussies in England.It is Spring over there and it is still snowing.
We have 10 Tests against the Poms. You may be right about growth etc etc, but if the Poms beat us 7-0 there are going to be a lot of people looking for new jobs at CA. The weather may be the only saving grace for the Aussies in England.It is Spring over there and it is still snowing.
nairbe
Active Member
funny i see it the opposite with Arthur and Clarke. I think Arthur is up to the job and he may have discovered a team that has more divisions than South Africa but he will settle the side if he had a captain that was not the cause of most of the division. Wonder why Hussey left? funny that we also lost Katich when he was in the worlds top 4 and have never been able to settle the top order ever since. Clarke is not a captain, i said at the start he is a Kim Hughes figure and the team will struggle while he leads it. And yes the captain selector concept has failed and should be forgotten forever.
I still maintain that the issue starts with the selectors for Australia, they just seem to be ruining it for the team.
CLOCKER
Active Member
Australia has just suffered one of he biggest series losses in their history. Now coming up against the Poms for 10 Tests. Mickey Arthur will be very worried and sooner or later the selectors as well. Not sure what the selectors can really do. No one is putting up their hands. Paine made a duck in the Shield final, Quiney has completely disappeared from the radar, Ferguson makes runs in Shield but is overlooked to Smith and Henriques.Alex Doolan has been consistent for a couple of years but cannot get a look in. I wonder if Watson stumbled upon a solution by batting Cowan at 5? Maxwell opening was crazy. I think he should be focusing on just holding his spot in the team, let alone opening the batting. Why Watson did not open is beyond me. This was the Sheffield Shield team of the year recently announced:
Chris Rogers, Phillip Hughes, Alex Doolan, Ricky Ponting (capt), Callum Ferguson, Moises Henriques, Brad Haddin, Ashton Agar, Luke Butterworth, Chadd Sayers, Jackson Bird, Mark Cosgrove (12th man)...interesting no Khawaja.
Not very encouraging. Agar and Butterworth are propsects, but nothing on the batting front. Need to go back to basics and question what it is that all these high paid coaches are doing. Are too many hack players moving from State to State making a living for a decade which result in a spot being lost to a young player?
What good will Ricky Ponting, Haddin, Hussey, Hauritz etc serve playing Shield cricket next season? Open to debate.
A lot of rounders in the competition because of the lure of 20/20 $$$$$.
Chris Rogers, Phillip Hughes, Alex Doolan, Ricky Ponting (capt), Callum Ferguson, Moises Henriques, Brad Haddin, Ashton Agar, Luke Butterworth, Chadd Sayers, Jackson Bird, Mark Cosgrove (12th man)...interesting no Khawaja.
Not very encouraging. Agar and Butterworth are propsects, but nothing on the batting front. Need to go back to basics and question what it is that all these high paid coaches are doing. Are too many hack players moving from State to State making a living for a decade which result in a spot being lost to a young player?
What good will Ricky Ponting, Haddin, Hussey, Hauritz etc serve playing Shield cricket next season? Open to debate.
A lot of rounders in the competition because of the lure of 20/20 $$$$$.
nairbe
Active Member
Need to have a good look at what depth and young talent these teams have. With Ponting and Hussey they could be great mentors to young players in on field strategy and discipline as for the rest they are already past the point. Just too much money i suppose.
The selectors need to bunker down with a team. Pick the 14 players you think have the right mental stuff set an order and stick to it for the whole ten tests coming. This is the what was done back in the eighties and it hurt for a while but those players learnt the craft and had success together, then the incoming players like steve and mark waugh and Ponting were able to join a united team with a clear direction. Time and patience is the key, oh and the T20 players need to forget test cricket the two just don't mix.
The selectors need to bunker down with a team. Pick the 14 players you think have the right mental stuff set an order and stick to it for the whole ten tests coming. This is the what was done back in the eighties and it hurt for a while but those players learnt the craft and had success together, then the incoming players like steve and mark waugh and Ponting were able to join a united team with a clear direction. Time and patience is the key, oh and the T20 players need to forget test cricket the two just don't mix.
My 17 man Ashes squad; Half what i expect, half what i wan't.
1. E.Cowan - despite what statistically will say a poor tour for cowan, i believe asides clarke, he showed the most determination and pride to play for Australia with regards to the way he went about his batting. Personally i thought he was lucky to go to india, but he proved to me that he is the type of guy we need at the top of the order in England.
2. D.Warner - Seems to be a certainty to be on the plane, but i'm not all that sold on him as a test batsman. IMO could really struggle in England.
3. P.Hughes - A very interesting time for hughes. The ashes will make or break his test career. Many think he will struggle in England, are they forgetting that he was there last year playing county? and he played exceptionally well. I would stick with him, and bat him at 3.
4. S.Watson - Last chance for Watson. Must bowl in England, the condtions suit him, could be a real weapon. Will 100% be there in the first test(barring injury) but failure in the first few tests with the bat, could spell the end to his test career.
5. M.Clarke - don't need to say anything really, but leave him at 5.
6. D.Hussey - unlikely to happen, but could fill the void needed as an older head in the batting order. Technique could be a problem but seriously, people are up and about over Doolan who had a good season and averaged 40 odd. Hussey has a career shield average of over 50... this guy is a star, and its a disgrace he hasn't played for Australia. Should have toured india, and would have proved his worth.
7. M.Wade - still ahead of Haddin, poor tour batting wise, but much better with the gloves.
8. M.Starc - not sure about starc, great lower order batsman, have him in due to bowling variety. Needs to take wickets.
9. P.Siddle - would be first picked after clarke, lock him in.
10. J.Pattinson - patto is a certainty as well, will be our biggest threat with the ball in my opinion.
11. N.Lyon - looked awesome in the final test, clearly our number 1 spinner.
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12. S.O'keefe/A.Agar - 50/50 imo, youth vs experience, both ahead of doherty.
13. L.Butterworth - haven't seen much of him really, awesome stats this season. Can bat as well.
14. J.Bird - didn't get a chance in India, but england suits his bowling. Although i don't think you can play siddle, patto and bird in the same team.
15. S.Smith - won a spot with his performances in India, will tour.
16. B.Haddin - back up keeper.
17. S.Marsh - big call, but if top order fails, he is the man in my opinion. Looked awesome before injury, hopefully he gets fit and firing. Class batsman.
others who i would consider touring would be; Doolan(great season), Silk(youth, showed great promise in the final), Maxwell(bowled really well in India, is not a top 7 bat), Rodgers(experience, great season), Maddinson(good season, youth), Harris(fit and ready to go, suits conditions).
1. E.Cowan - despite what statistically will say a poor tour for cowan, i believe asides clarke, he showed the most determination and pride to play for Australia with regards to the way he went about his batting. Personally i thought he was lucky to go to india, but he proved to me that he is the type of guy we need at the top of the order in England.
2. D.Warner - Seems to be a certainty to be on the plane, but i'm not all that sold on him as a test batsman. IMO could really struggle in England.
3. P.Hughes - A very interesting time for hughes. The ashes will make or break his test career. Many think he will struggle in England, are they forgetting that he was there last year playing county? and he played exceptionally well. I would stick with him, and bat him at 3.
4. S.Watson - Last chance for Watson. Must bowl in England, the condtions suit him, could be a real weapon. Will 100% be there in the first test(barring injury) but failure in the first few tests with the bat, could spell the end to his test career.
5. M.Clarke - don't need to say anything really, but leave him at 5.
6. D.Hussey - unlikely to happen, but could fill the void needed as an older head in the batting order. Technique could be a problem but seriously, people are up and about over Doolan who had a good season and averaged 40 odd. Hussey has a career shield average of over 50... this guy is a star, and its a disgrace he hasn't played for Australia. Should have toured india, and would have proved his worth.
7. M.Wade - still ahead of Haddin, poor tour batting wise, but much better with the gloves.
8. M.Starc - not sure about starc, great lower order batsman, have him in due to bowling variety. Needs to take wickets.
9. P.Siddle - would be first picked after clarke, lock him in.
10. J.Pattinson - patto is a certainty as well, will be our biggest threat with the ball in my opinion.
11. N.Lyon - looked awesome in the final test, clearly our number 1 spinner.
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12. S.O'keefe/A.Agar - 50/50 imo, youth vs experience, both ahead of doherty.
13. L.Butterworth - haven't seen much of him really, awesome stats this season. Can bat as well.
14. J.Bird - didn't get a chance in India, but england suits his bowling. Although i don't think you can play siddle, patto and bird in the same team.
15. S.Smith - won a spot with his performances in India, will tour.
16. B.Haddin - back up keeper.
17. S.Marsh - big call, but if top order fails, he is the man in my opinion. Looked awesome before injury, hopefully he gets fit and firing. Class batsman.
others who i would consider touring would be; Doolan(great season), Silk(youth, showed great promise in the final), Maxwell(bowled really well in India, is not a top 7 bat), Rodgers(experience, great season), Maddinson(good season, youth), Harris(fit and ready to go, suits conditions).
CLOCKER
Active Member
Well put together summation Sidvic.
Yet another debacle with our selectors. Cricket Australia dictated that it was not a priority that a selector watch the Shield Final. Instead the selectors were glued to the TV watching Australia lose in 3 days. James Sutherland’s days are numbered.
The trouble with this tour will be that the same names will be given more chances and when they fail the selectors will have to make a choice of sticking with them for Australia’s summer or take a chance and rebuild.
I noticed you have not considered Tim Paine. He needs to go on the tour as a backup batsman and keep the foot on the throat of Wade. Haddin’s had his day.
Rhino Harris has to go on the tour. Hits the wicket hard and can get the ball to move around. One of the few bowlers that bothered the Poms on the last tour, and has proven his fitness in the recent Sheffield Shield season. Watson in my opinion should have been canned for walking out, has to open. His bowling days are behind him as his body is soft. Warner is a Clarke cheer leader and therefore will go to England, even though imo he doesn’t deserve his spot.
Batsmen need to know on this tour that if they fail they have someone waiting to take their spot. This was not the case in India.
S.Watson
D.Warner/ Rogers
P.Hughes/Marsh/Doolan
M.Clarke
C. Ferguson/Cowan
M.Wade/Paine
M.Starc
P.Siddle
J.Pattinson
N.Lyon/Maxwell
J.Bird
R.Harris
Yet another debacle with our selectors. Cricket Australia dictated that it was not a priority that a selector watch the Shield Final. Instead the selectors were glued to the TV watching Australia lose in 3 days. James Sutherland’s days are numbered.
The trouble with this tour will be that the same names will be given more chances and when they fail the selectors will have to make a choice of sticking with them for Australia’s summer or take a chance and rebuild.
I noticed you have not considered Tim Paine. He needs to go on the tour as a backup batsman and keep the foot on the throat of Wade. Haddin’s had his day.
Rhino Harris has to go on the tour. Hits the wicket hard and can get the ball to move around. One of the few bowlers that bothered the Poms on the last tour, and has proven his fitness in the recent Sheffield Shield season. Watson in my opinion should have been canned for walking out, has to open. His bowling days are behind him as his body is soft. Warner is a Clarke cheer leader and therefore will go to England, even though imo he doesn’t deserve his spot.
Batsmen need to know on this tour that if they fail they have someone waiting to take their spot. This was not the case in India.
S.Watson
D.Warner/ Rogers
P.Hughes/Marsh/Doolan
M.Clarke
C. Ferguson/Cowan
M.Wade/Paine
M.Starc
P.Siddle
J.Pattinson
N.Lyon/Maxwell
J.Bird
R.Harris
yep agree with alot of what you said. Paine way well be a better option than wade, but i wouldn't be surprised if the selectors opt for haddin as back up.
For me its Harris or Bird... I really liked bird against sri lanka, but you are probably right, Harris has given them a hard time in the past. Harris and patto opening the bowling with pace and swing could be deadly, with siddle coming in first change.
I still think Watson has to bowl in England. Especially because the selectors seem hell bent on having an all-rounder, and for god's sake; henriques and maxwell are not good enough at either category to be selected.
Rogers has unfortunately been put on the never again list after his one test. Being joined by bob quiney. Therefore both are no chance of touring.
For me its Harris or Bird... I really liked bird against sri lanka, but you are probably right, Harris has given them a hard time in the past. Harris and patto opening the bowling with pace and swing could be deadly, with siddle coming in first change.
I still think Watson has to bowl in England. Especially because the selectors seem hell bent on having an all-rounder, and for god's sake; henriques and maxwell are not good enough at either category to be selected.
Rogers has unfortunately been put on the never again list after his one test. Being joined by bob quiney. Therefore both are no chance of touring.
Some nice squads there guys, not too many changes you could possibly come up with from those teams.
Batting is definitely the issue at this stage, our bowlers should go well over there but we're going to need the top order to step up. Apart from Clarke we have no standouts at the moment and that is worrying.
Batting is definitely the issue at this stage, our bowlers should go well over there but we're going to need the top order to step up. Apart from Clarke we have no standouts at the moment and that is worrying.
futureblackcap
Well-Known Member
But Henriques did well in India and you picked Steven Smith in your Ashes squad, based on runs?
CLOCKER
Active Member
Rogers, Marsh, Doolan, Ferguson and Paine. Are these not enough? Interesting to read that Watson is about to be rewarded with a seven figure contract. On what basis? Hasn't made any runs, can't bowl because his body is not upto it and spat the dummy in India and only came back when they gave him the Captaincy.
CA has money, but do not reward mediocracy. Every batsmen except for Clarke should be on the minimum base contract. If there is money left over then spend it on grass roots cricket. Next time India come out, let's hope that the pitches are so green that they will be trying to work out where the outfield finishes and the pitch starts.
futureblackcap
Well-Known Member
Thoughts on the Australian contract list?
CA 2013/14 contract list: George Bailey, Michael Clarke, Ed Cowan, Pat Cummins, Xavier Doherty, James Faulkner, Brad Haddin, Ryan Harris, Ben Hilfenhaus, Phillip Hughes, Mitchell Johnson, Nathan Lyon, Glenn Maxwell, ClintMcKay, James Pattinson, Peter Siddle, Mitchell Starc, Matthew Wade, David Warner, Shane Watson.
CA 2013/14 contract list: George Bailey, Michael Clarke, Ed Cowan, Pat Cummins, Xavier Doherty, James Faulkner, Brad Haddin, Ryan Harris, Ben Hilfenhaus, Phillip Hughes, Mitchell Johnson, Nathan Lyon, Glenn Maxwell, ClintMcKay, James Pattinson, Peter Siddle, Mitchell Starc, Matthew Wade, David Warner, Shane Watson.
nairbe
Active Member
Yep have been looking at that. D Hussey missed out because they were looking forward so please explain Doherty, Haddin, Harris, Hilfenhaus, Johnson, this is the has been list. If it really is the future how about Ahmed, Bird, Paine, Cutting, Khawaja, Henriques and Rogers. The directionless rubbish is getting boring. And six figures for Watson? please i am fronting the boss for a raise if that fizzer is worth that.