2014/2015 Barclay Shield

[brutal]

I can almost rival that Brutal. I was caught off what was a blinder, diving forwards an inch off the ground, and stood my ground in disbelief and then turned to the umpire to make sure that it was a fair catch. (It was, but I don't walk)

The umpire didn't give me out, to rub salt in the wound, he was standing there clapping the young kid who caught it. Haha

Whilst not a rule as such, if it's not a clear decision. I have no issues whatsoever with an umpire giving the batsmen the benefit of doubt.

In general I don't have an issue either, but don't stand there and hide behind a rule that doesn't exist. I think a point to be considered is the guy who took the catch (Shannnon Malone) is not the type to claim something that isn't. As a batsman myself, think I'd be happy taking the word of most fielders in that situation, although we all know a few that can't be trusted

 

[brutal]

I have watched a lot of games in Barclay over the past few years and , yes , the standard of umpiring is certainly not what it used to be.
In saying that , if that is all we have working for the dvca , we just have to put up with what we are dealt unfortunately.
Im actually thinking of offering my services in a few years time when the little ones are a bit older.
In relation to the decision , I guess the umps are there to adjudicate and not the players. If they havent seen a clear catch , then I guess the benefit of doubt would happen. I dont think there is a rule as such which would apply in these instances and if the ump did in fact say this they should pull out the book and show the applicable rule.
Ps - try not forget about the mac v research game on the show next week , some people are actually listening

Won't be in next week Serg, MC at my nieces wedding. Just checked the forcast for next Saturday, 37 degrees. May have been a good move after all to bowl first. At the very least, no difference. Nice to meet you in person yesterday, as well.

 

[Tongs]

In general I don't have an issue either, but don't stand there and hide behind a rule that doesn't exist. I think a point to be considered is the guy who took the catch (Shannnon Malone) is not the type to claim something that isn't. As a batsman myself, think I'd be happy taking the word of most fielders in that situation, although we all know a few that can't be trusted

The problem is, it's too hard to know who to trust and who you can't.

Sometimes it's not player by player decision, sometimes you make the call based on the club you're playing. I could name a club or two that I would never trust their word.

 

[harry2bob]

Have heard that at a BS club last night, discussions were had at training, and players have refused to play with their clubs assistant coach, and he was sacked last night. Not to return.

any more on this one??

And Rosanna and Diamond Creek...boring!!!!!!!!! 1st XI and 2nd XI....just got past 200 in 2 grades...well done!! how did your scrabble nights go?

 

[MSW]

Finals not far away. Predictions on finals venues for first 3 grades?

 

[CricketBox]

Finals not far away. Predictions on finals venues for first 3 grades?

I'd play the BS at OPSF.

Plenty of parking, good ground with great facilities and probably one of the better all weather pitches going around.

Just my opinion and with them not getting anywhere near the finals would be a good neutral venue.

How is Lower Eltham's ground looking this season?

Obviously Eltham will be used for the MS GF if Eltham makes it........................................

 

[shortnwide]

Can someone inform me if it is in the rules of cricket or a bylaw of the DVCA, that the batsman "must" be given the benefit of doubt? Apparently and umpire stated this when a batsman (rightfully) chose to hold his ground despite the fielder thinking and stating that he had taken a legal catch. When questioned as to why he did not take the fielders word, the umpire said the rules of cricket state that the batsman must be given the benefit of doubt. If someone can find that passage in the rules, can they please post it. This may rival the umpire who said a batsman cannot be given out under any circumstance if the ball pitches outside "off" stump. In future, perhaps it should be a prerequisite for umpires to know the basic laws of dismissal.

http://www.lords.org/mcc/laws-of-cricket/laws/law-27-appeals/

Subsection 6 seems to cover benefit of the doubt.

 

[CricketBox]

http://www.lords.org/mcc/laws-of-cricket/laws/law-27-appeals/

Subsection 6 seems to cover benefit of the doubt.

Suggest this should be shown to all umpires in the DVCA.

I don't want to umpire bash as it's a ordinary look and to be honest we have some really good umpires in the DVCA, and some good blokes amongst them, but they are let down by simple rules being ignored too often.

Benefit of the doubt is a forgotten rule in this comp.

I find that majority of umpires are good in most areas except for LBW, where they have no idea whatsoever. This goes for both sides each week, whether my team is batting or bowling to be honest. It's a lottery.

 

[Tongs]

any more on this one??

And Rosanna and Diamond Creek...boring!!!!!!!!! 1st XI and 2nd XI....just got past 200 in 2 grades...well done!! how did your scrabble nights go?

I have heard a story or two about this particular Assistant coach. I have heard that he has been shopping himself around a few clubs for the highest bidder (where the club is based is irrelevant). And there was a falling out at training, and the down fall was that he was sacked after the players declared that they would not play with the said person.

And no, the player didn't play in any grade on the weekend.

 

[Tongs]

I'd play the BS at OPSF.

Plenty of parking, good ground with great facilities and probably one of the better all weather pitches going around.

Just my opinion and with them not getting anywhere near the finals would be a good neutral venue.

How is Lower Eltham's ground looking this season?

Obviously Eltham will be used for the MS GF if Eltham makes it........................................

There's lots of .......... there cricketbox, do you not think we will make it?

And do you rate the OPSF ground a better total facility to Elthams? I have never been there, so I couldn't comment.

 

[MSW]

I'd play the BS at OPSF.

Plenty of parking, good ground with great facilities and probably one of the better all weather pitches going around.

Just my opinion and with them not getting anywhere near the finals would be a good neutral venue.

How is Lower Eltham's ground looking this season?

Obviously Eltham will be used for the MS GF if Eltham makes it........................................

Hard to look pass Eltham and Lower Eltham. Depends on condition of grounds. Other clubs I think with the facilities to host a top grade Grand Final would be Hursty, Heidelberg and Epping.

 

[Tongs]

Hard to look pass Eltham and Lower Eltham. Depends on condition of grounds. Other clubs I think with the facilities to host a top grade Grand Final would be Hursty, Heidelberg and Epping.

For what its worth, Eltham's ground is the best I have seen it in, in years. We've been lucky with weather this year. That, and we have a new deck this season, where runs are being made. So there is no worries about that either.

 

[Tongs]

Suggest this should be shown to all umpires in the DVCA.

I don't want to umpire bash as it's a ordinary look and to be honest we have some really good umpires in the DVCA, and some good blokes amongst them, but they are let down by simple rules being ignored too often.

Benefit of the doubt is a forgotten rule in this comp.

I find that majority of umpires are good in most areas except for LBW, where they have no idea whatsoever. This goes for both sides each week, whether my team is batting or bowling to be honest. It's a lottery.

Do you know what I think half the problem is, and its not the umpires. Its the players. Some of the things that I see players on a regular basis (both mine and the opposition) that they think are out, are nothing short of laughable. Or the flip side, where they think they are not out but are plumb.

For example, pitching outside leg especially to left handers. Its not out. With the majority of bowlers right arm over the wicket, the bounce, and you'd have to be swinging it a bit, I find it very hard to believe that Left Handers are given out correctly.

9/10 the ball is probably going over, yet the bowler is still filthy that they are given not out.

Not to say the umpires can't improve. But when the players themselves get it wrong lots, its hard to pot another bloke who also sometimes gets it wrong.

 

[shortnwide]

Do you know what I think half the problem is, and its not the umpires. Its the players. Some of the things that I see players on a regular basis (both mine and the opposition) that they think are out, are nothing short of laughable. Or the flip side, where they think they are not out but are plumb.

For example, pitching outside leg especially to left handers. Its not out. With the majority of bowlers right arm over the wicket, the bounce, and you'd have to be swinging it a bit, I find it very hard to believe that Left Handers are given out correctly.

9/10 the ball is probably going over, yet the bowler is still filthy that they are given not out.

Not to say the umpires can't improve. But when the players themselves get it wrong lots, its hard to pot another bloke who also sometimes gets it wrong.

Agreed, I've had two this year where I don't believe I was out. I haven't had any go the other way but over the years they have. Umpire is standing at the other end, calling it as they see it, and as best they can. I play a shot, scrape the ground, makes a similar noise to a knick as the ball goes close pass the edge, I'm given out. Umpire sees it, it looks out, hears a noise that sounds sharpish, at the right time and gives you out. It's the wrong decision but its not a terrible one by any stretch.

Too many guys linger, point to pads, bats (in lbw cases), shake heads, question umpires.

Just get off the f*cking ground. It creates a poor us culture within the team and bad feeling between the two teams (we give it to any batsmen who doesn't walk straight off, rightly or wrongly) and players and the umpires. These guys aren't professional umpires, who also get it wrong.

But there are some really ordinary umpires out there, who need better training. As long as umpires don't miss the howlers, then the main source of frustration is paying too many lbws (particularly on syntho!). So that's where "umpires school" should be focused. If umpires just get the obvious decisions right 8.5-9/10 and don't try to get involved in the game then that's adequate for this level of cricket in my opinion.

 

[Underarm28]

Agreed, I've had two this year where I don't believe I was out. I haven't had any go the other way but over the years they have. Umpire is standing at the other end, calling it as they see it, and as best they can. I play a shot, scrape the ground, makes a similar noise to a knick as the ball goes close pass the edge, I'm given out. Umpire sees it, it looks out, hears a noise that sounds sharpish, at the right time and gives you out. It's the wrong decision but its not a terrible one by any stretch.

Too many guys linger, point to pads, bats (in lbw cases), shake heads, question umpires.

Just get off the f*cking ground. It creates a poor us culture within the team and bad feeling between the two teams (we give it to any batsmen who doesn't walk straight off, rightly or wrongly) and players and the umpires. These guys aren't professional umpires, who also get it wrong.

But there are some really ordinary umpires out there, who need better training. As long as umpires don't miss the howlers, then the main source of frustration is paying too many lbws (particularly on syntho!). So that's where "umpires school" should be focused. If umpires just get the obvious decisions right 8.5-9/10 and don't try to get involved in the game then that's adequate for this level of cricket in my opinion.

It is simple, its park cricket. Adopt the rules used in Vets (except LBW).

If you nick it, walk.
If you are in doubt about the catch, ask the fielder, if he says yes, walk.

IMO (In Vets), not one ever looks at the umpire for a catch decision. Off you walk with a smile on your face knowing that you are still playing cricket at the age of 40+ and that you are still getting smashed by Plenty.

Cheaters will always be cheaters

 

[CricketBox]

There's lots of .......... there cricketbox, do you not think we will make it?

And do you rate the OPSF ground a better total facility to Elthams? I have never been there, so I couldn't comment.

Was more a dig at the finishing 4th and getting a home GF last year than questioning if you'll make it this year mate!

FWIW I am pretty certain you will make the GF. And hope you win it to be honest.

As for the grounds, you know my thoughts on yours, to me it's the home of finals at the moment, great atmosphere and facilities. Haven't seen the actual surface this year though so can't comment.

OPSF facilities are good, but I do prefer the atmosphere that the hills on both sides at Eltham create for the supporters. Good times..........

 

[CricketBox]

Agreed, I've had two this year where I don't believe I was out. I haven't had any go the other way but over the years they have. Umpire is standing at the other end, calling it as they see it, and as best they can. I play a shot, scrape the ground, makes a similar noise to a knick as the ball goes close pass the edge, I'm given out. Umpire sees it, it looks out, hears a noise that sounds sharpish, at the right time and gives you out. It's the wrong decision but its not a terrible one by any stretch.

Too many guys linger, point to pads, bats (in lbw cases), shake heads, question umpires.

Just get off the f*cking ground. It creates a poor us culture within the team and bad feeling between the two teams (we give it to any batsmen who doesn't walk straight off, rightly or wrongly) and players and the umpires. These guys aren't professional umpires, who also get it wrong.

But there are some really ordinary umpires out there, who need better training. As long as umpires don't miss the howlers, then the main source of frustration is paying too many lbws (particularly on syntho!). So that's where "umpires school" should be focused. If umpires just get the obvious decisions right 8.5-9/10 and don't try to get involved in the game then that's adequate for this level of cricket in my opinion.

Agree with you here mate.

LBW is the one that is consistantly incorrect week in week out.

Apparently the balls we use don't swing or bounce and the stumps the DVCA use are a metre wide and 2 metres high.

It's not an easy job though so the comp and the clubs need to support a way of fixing the problem, not just the umpires.

At $26 an hour in the workplace you'd expect some standard of performance wouldn't you?

Make fees higher and use money to train umpires etc. Anyone got any other suggestions that would be a good start?

Something like this needs to happen and I'm happy to support it.

 

[Warwick Todd]

Agree with you here mate.

LBW is the one that is consistantly incorrect week in week out.

Apparently the balls we use don't swing or bounce and the stumps the DVCA use are a metre wide and 2 metres high.

It's not an easy job though so the comp and the clubs need to support a way of fixing the problem, not just the umpires.

At $26 an hour in the workplace you'd expect some standard of performance wouldn't you?

Make fees higher and use money to train umpires etc. Anyone got any other suggestions that would be a good start?

Something like this needs to happen and I'm happy to support it.

I think umpires need to be told that unless it hits a batsman on the foot in front of middle stump, then its not out.

So many full balls bounce over the stumps on all weather pitches, it amazes me that umpires give lbws. Are they not watching the game? Do they watch too much turf cricket on tv?

One of the benefits of playing lower grade cricket without umpires is the terrible lbws no longer exist. Sure you might miss out on a couple of yorkers that would knock over the stumps, but its a trade off I'm happy to live with.

 

[brutal]

One on Saturday wouldn't even give that out

 

[brutal]

http://www.lords.org/mcc/laws-of-cricket/laws/law-27-appeals/

Subsection 6 seems to cover benefit of the doubt.

He was 10 metres away. If he can't make a decision from that distance, he shouldn't be umpiring. I think the doubt came into his mind when the batsman held his ground. In other words, not capable of making the decision himself. For the record I think the two best umps this year, and we've had them on more than one occasion, are David Moore and Paul Holzer. The former Diamo prez, Gerry has been good as well.