Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
conor;391368 said:I was just having a bowl and the leg spinners were going all over the place!, has anybody got any tips to improve my accuracy? help please
conor;391368 said:I was just having a bowl and the leg spinners were going all over the place!, has anybody got any tips to improve my accuracy? help please
strof;395906 said:you could not be more wrong dave!. whilst he may dabble on here he bowls leg spin almost every day. i should know i am his dad lol!
we have just moved from tarmac to a synthetic wicket a couple of weeks ago. we have found a place with a nearly new track no nets up yet !
he got over the googly syndrome and he can now spin it both ways. its just the accuracy now as his post alludes to.
. he was bowling from a shorter distance 12 yards no run up on thursday and he had it spinning like a top. from 21 yards with a run up nowt!
tomorrow i think i will get him to bowl from a shorter distance and take it from there try and build his confidence up
probably something to do with his positioning etc on release?
strof;395906 said:you could not be more wrong dave!. whilst he may dabble on here he bowls leg spin almost every day. i should know i am his dad lol!
we have just moved from tarmac to a synthetic wicket a couple of weeks ago. we have found a place with a nearly new track no nets up yet !
he got over the googly syndrome and he can now spin it both ways. its just the accuracy now as his post alludes to.
. he was bowling from a shorter distance 12 yards no run up on thursday and he had it spinning like a top. from 21 yards with a run up nowt!
tomorrow i think i will get him to bowl from a shorter distance and take it from there try and build his confidence up
probably something to do with his positioning etc on release?
strof;395906 said:you could not be more wrong dave!. whilst he may dabble on here he bowls leg spin almost every day. i should know i am his dad lol!
we have just moved from tarmac to a synthetic wicket a couple of weeks ago. we have found a place with a nearly new track no nets up yet !
he got over the googly syndrome and he can now spin it both ways. its just the accuracy now as his post alludes to.
. he was bowling from a shorter distance 12 yards no run up on thursday and he had it spinning like a top. from 21 yards with a run up nowt!
tomorrow i think i will get him to bowl from a shorter distance and take it from there try and build his confidence up
probably something to do with his positioning etc on release?
someblokecalleddave;395928 said:That's good to hear. Depending on how old he is, he may only have to bowl 20 yards maximum anyway? Yeah there's a number of ways of getting there in the end. Macca and Jim advocate spinning the ball hard all the times and working gradually towards your correct length. Philpott advises the same thing.
I have a slightly different approach - yeah, spin the ball, but maybe don't get too bogged down in the need to be make it turn at right angles to the pitch every time it lands. That perhaps should be your ultimate goal, but I'd say that if you're getting the ball to turn off the wicket enough to find the edge of the bat when the batsman is playing a drive or forward defensive block you're doing enough. I think people can get too tied up in trying to get the ball to turn like Shane Warne every time they're bowling?
I think you need to get a grip established where the ball does turn and feels comfortable and then work with that. As Macca says put a target down, I used a bit of hardboard that was about 3' long and 9'' wide and practiced getting the ball on that. Because of the length it made me focus on the need to bowl a decent line more than the length. I added the length aspect later. But I feel that getting the line sorted is important because anything that goes leg-side is likely to be put away for 4 when you're starting out.
someblokecalleddave;395974 said:I've just read a post by Liz Ward elsewhere and I think I'm coming round to your viewpoint, e.g. if you can spin the ball hard, don't discard that aspect, look at other areas that may be affecting your accuracy.
doctortran;396026 said:When you bowl, and when you throw -- velocity has nothing to do with your arm strength. In baseball, arm flexibility is one facet of speed -- but you hopefully don't have too much arm flexibility when you bowl in cricket (i.e. cheating).
Rather most of it comes from the sequence of muscles you use that lead up to the movement of your arm.
My point? Velocity not only means speed of the ball going from bowler to batsman, but also off-side to on-side. Mechanics is CRUCIAL to direction -- alongside what happens with your fingers and your wrist. When it comes to direction, or lack there of, it almost always has to do with your body -- rather than your spinning hand. From that context I really identified with the thread title of "line and length without spin".
Some advice? Experiment for yourself -- you are the best judge of your own body. But some tips!
Really think about your thighs, your hips, and your shoulders.
Align your hips and shoulders at ball release -- but make sure before and after ball release they have largely different alignments. Watch Warne at different stages of his career -- the ball of the century to gatting had his hips and shoulders parallel to the ground at ball release.... the ball of the century to Strauss had his hips at 45 degrees and so too his shoulders.
Your thighs give you power. Studies suggest that power is developed by the initiating, stretching, exertion of force (whatever you want to call it) of your large muscles (thighs.... chest.. shoulders) then your medium sized muscles (bicep etc.) then your small muscles like those in your fingers. Yet I emphasize the thighs because their use seems counter-intuitive to propelling objects with your arms. Really think about power positions.... where your thighs are pointing towards when you want to bowl fast, when you want to smash a ball for six, when you want to do something really powerful.... where do your thighs move towards. You always hear about transference of weight when commentators talk about beautiful cover drives -- think about how your thighs can move to create this transference.
Good luck -- and may you always remember that spin bowling isn't called a craft for no reason.
someblokecalleddave;396027 said:Have a look at the video clips of my bowling on youtube, see what you reckon YouTube - Someblokecalleddave leg breaks rotational analysis slow motion.avi In support of what you're saying here, all my physical problems at the minute stem from problems with my calf muscles, leading to problems with my heels (Similar to Plantar Faciitis). I'm currently working on my rotation and will be uploading more recent clips so that people can comment on what I'm doing wrong.
doctortran;396058 said:Again I don't mean to impose a law for bowling leg spin, so take up what you will.
Is the pain in your right leg or your left leg? or both?
First things first -- your leg pain. What can we do to lessen the pain -- what could cause pain from your mechanics.
Pause your video at 0:14. Look at your right knee pushing up from the ground -- it is bent. Now imagine sprinting 100 metres with your legs pushing off the ground with bent knees. *pain*. Definitely straighten out that leg and fully extend from it -- it will give you more power in your delivery and it might even help with your leg problems.
Then watch from 0:14 to 0:19 specifically looking at your front foot (left leg). You pivot a lot. That could cause pain in your feet and as your feet are connected to your calves -- perhaps some referred pain? Perhaps that is inevitable for a leg spinner. But perhaps the most worrying thing is at 0:19 -- just look at the position of your left leg. Your leg is about 11 o'clock to the ground. Instead of forces acting with the ground going straight up and down -- now they have a horizontal component which can cause shear (fancy for horizontal) stress and strain. The word "shear" in itself is scary.
How do we fix this though? I think pivot less. Not only will this help you keep your legs more healthy, and probably your back too, but it may well help your bowling. In that split second between 0:16 and 0:17 your entire body points from straight to the batsman and then to... wait for it..... point! Perhaps we should reduce it to pointing to first slip.
Some final pointers: hip and waist alignment -- pretty good. Definitely room for improvement -- more leg drive UP could improve it or having your shoulders more horizontal at ball release might cause improvements. Of course your leg drive is dependent on your legs so I suppose that is a valid reason. Your non-bowling arm as I commented on for Jim's bowling is pretty vital. I think you are using it -- but perhaps start it from your right hip and then down your left side. Just like when you burn more calories when you power your arms, the further your arms have to move, the further your upper body has to flex or extend which means more energy burned, more power exerted, and faster and big rips of the ball.
Also I think it would be a good idea to have some sort of concept of relaxation with regards mechanics. Studies suggest that many sportsmen and women apply relaxation before force exertion between their different phases of movement. For example in running, you should try to push off the ground so your foot is as vertical as possible, and in mid-air you relax so that it is parallel to the ground -- relaxation before force exertion. For bowlers, especially spin bowlers this relaxation point should be just before you take off. Really try to exert less force on the ground, sort of try to feel lighter with your knees before you go into delivery stride. Watch Warnie and his sort of idiosyncratic bounce in his delivery stride -- he sort of walks in... then drops a little then goes up in the air to bowl. That drop is his knees loosening and relaxing under the weight of his body -- try it.. it may help your bowling and your injury.
someblokecalleddave;396164 said:The right leg is fine. The problem is with the left leg. I'm aware of the over-rotation and I'm currently working on it and I think I've rectified it to some extent, although I'm possibly still going round too much still? I've noticed in the last few days with an enormous increase in bowling activity running up to the new season I'm a lot more accurate - could this be down to the reduction in the rotation I wonder?