2016/2017 Mash Shield

Artie Bucco

Active Member
Are you seriously bagging a club that has made 4 Grand Finals in 7 years?
How many GF's has your club made and won in the past 7 years?
There are clubs out there that haven't made finals at all in 7 years, never mind a GF
Nobody rated Greensborough at the start of the season, in fact most people bagged the club and wrote them off. They bagged their recruiting, they bagged their players and nobody tipped them to make finals. They won outright in the last round to make the finals, then won a tough semi final. Then bowled out the top side for 122 and fell at the final hurdle. Not bad for a club with "no chance"!
If you want to bag a club for that, then you're nothing but a keyboard warrior!
Hold up champ, no need to get so defensive, people are entitled to their opinion. See some people dont see it the way you do. Some people see a club that left its former comp because it was too big and too strong but since leaving has lost every chance at promotion its had and a large chunk of its teams in junior and seniors. To then have the audacity to bring up your relevance in 3rd division and act as if you silenced the critics by making it to the GF is laughable. The only keyboard warrior here is you, instead of worrying about what is written on here you should try and figure out what the hell happened to your club and doing something about it then you wont have to worry about getting bagged
 
Touched another nerve did I Midwicket. Don't worry, you'll get another chance to lose next season.
Not at all as I'm not involved with Greensborough in anyway,just blokes like you have been trapping off for years from your disgraceful club,you're lucky you boys ain't playing Greensborough next season if it wasn't for the couple of imports after Chrissy.
 

PIETHROWER

New Member
Only reason the run rate was no more than 1.5 over was because the ground was so slow!. Didn't have anything to do with players being nervous. Value for shots were non existent. Both sides bowled well which even made it harder to score.
 

serg fernandez

Active Member
Three of those sides (Mill Park, Camrea and Hurstbridge) were just unlucky to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Any other year and they would still be playing in Money Shield. If the decision to create this new division was made 12 months earlier, then it would have been Lower Plenty playing in Mash Shield. Look what they have done in the 2 years since then.
Belittling Mash Shield isn't fair to the clubs playing there. They weren't necessarily consistently struggling clubs that had been down the bottom of the table for years. Just clubs in the wrong place at the wrong time
All clubs in the DVCA were aware of the 3 shields a year in advance. The clubs who got relegated werent unlucky as you suggest. They just werent as good as the other sides in their respective grades.
 

Artie Bucco

Active Member
Yep, everyone has an opinion. Opinions are like assholes; everyone has one and some of them stink.
I am entitled to defend my club. Should I sit back and let people have pot shots? Every club has it's ups and downs. For a club that has made finals 12 of 15 years, to have an "off" year the year they decide to create a third tier for the first time is unlucky, but we took our medicine. We were in full rebuild mode. The club didn't pay any players in 2015/2016. In fact, didn't even pay the coach. But we didn't bitch, didn't moan. Just got on with it. Copped the criticism, copped the derision from other clubs. The best way to answer the critics is to win. Making a GF this year and falling at the final hurdle looks like a pretty decent response to me. Winning would have been better, but it wasn't to be.
Just for the record, Greensborough didn't leave the HDCA because they were "too big and too strong" as you claim. They joined the DVCA as they thought that it was a superior competition and that the HDCA was too small to survive. As it turns out, they were right. They also felt that geographically, Greensborough was part of the Diamond Valley and would be better served playing in the area instead of travelling to places like Fitzroy to play matches. How do I know? Because I was there. I created and delivered the submission and the presentation to the DVCA Committee. Not an opinion. Something that isn't dealt with much on these forums.."Facts"!
I would love to know how many people on this site, are people that actual do things at their club. You know, Coaches (Junior and Senior), Committee Members, Captains. Those that actually give up their time in a positive manner rather than sitting back and criticising everyone else. It's easy to criticise. Much harder to actually try to do something positive.
As for your comment about trying to figure out what happened at my club. I have put my money where my mouth is. I do volunteer great chunks of my time and have done for over a decade. I have coached a junior side, I have captained senior sides, I have been a Committee Member for 10 years and have also been a member of the Club's Executive Committee for 7 years including 2 as President.
Two years into a rebuild and we have made a GF and increased our junior numbers from 7 players to over 50 players. We also have over 45 kids in our Milo program and huge numbers in our T20 Blast Centre.
If you want to criticise, fine. But do it with facts. If you want to have an intelligent conversation about the state of cricket and the challenges that we all face, I am all ears. If all that you want to do is criticise people and clubs with your opinions, what's the point? These forums should be great places to share ideas and to talk about the challenges that face cricket. Throwing mud at each other achieves nothing.
Of course you are and I expected you to. I'll retract my "keyboard warrior" comment as it was said as a throw away jibe in the context of one post and I already knew most of the things you mentioned you do for your club. Being unlucky and being in full rebuild mode are two contradictory points. All you can do is make it to the GF but as I said before the game history not on your side and as commendable as it is to have made so many in recent times it really doesn't matter unless you win. Fair points on the move over to DV, perhaps that was the beginning of then end for the HDCA with arguably its biggest club leaving but with a comp that size it was probably inevitable. Funny you mention how Lower Plenty were in the gun the year before you were. There is a pretty obvious reason for that. Henkel Maddox Meekins left one to go to the other. One has to wonder why that would be, why 3 products of the junior program all left together at what appeared to be a promising time on field. Obviously you would know more than maybe anyone, care to share your point of view?

Great to hear about junior numbers, hopefully they continue to increase and the numbers get back to where they were.
As for the state of cricket I don't like to be negative but I do think there is a problem. The retention of juniors coming into seniors must be at an all time low, so many kids are lost to footy and it doesn't help that a lot of the best kids cant play juniors on a Friday mid cricket season because of rep footy training. A lot of the best footy players are the best cricketers but gone are the days where people are happy to do both, footy is the more attractive sport and the demands of a modern day local football player are much more than they ever have been. Not sure what the answer is but it needs to be sorted at a young age because kids are giving it up as soon as their junior years are over.
 

shortnwide

Active Member
Three of those sides (Mill Park, Camrea and Hurstbridge) were just unlucky to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. Any other year and they would still be playing in Money Shield. If the decision to create this new division was made 12 months earlier, then it would have been Lower Plenty playing in Mash Shield. Look what they have done in the 2 years since then.
Belittling Mash Shield isn't fair to the clubs playing there. They weren't necessarily consistently struggling clubs that had been down the bottom of the table for years. Just clubs in the wrong place at the wrong time
Hurstbridge have two sides (& a Vets), one of which they had to forfeit at least once this season. PH have 3 sides. Mash, E & G4. And your club by the sounds of things had no juniors, a walk out of many of your best players (sounds like your club has hit rock bottom and is building back up). Thomastown has recently demerged. Its 2s are in E grade for one win, and 3s in F3.

I think the point is, its a weak grade with many of the clubs struggling or undeserved of a spot (Laurimar), whilst you make the point of being unlucky, I don't think you could argue that any clubs deserve to be in Money in the place of any incumbent clubs (with perhaps the exception of Whittlesea).

FWIW, I'm sure as you build your juniors back up you will earn your spot up in Money and be in a better position to compete. But the gap between the top two grades and the third is significant. A few of us are on the record as saying you don't want your club spending long in Mash.
 

_Blackhawk_

Active Member
With regards to juniors, that T20 blast program will be the death of under 14's cricket. If kids play that bastardized game until 12 years of age, they will never play proper under 14's cricket for a local side. It's all well and good for Cricket Australia to crap on about how many kids they have in the game, but their own program is starting to erode actual junior cricketers. I know myself, I've lost kids from our milo program that would have gone to Mods (now non-competitive) to play T20 blast.

I would never run a T20 blast program at our club, the DVCA doesn't give you credit for a side and you're slitting your own throat when it comes to teenage cricketers.
 

draught

Active Member
With regards to juniors, that T20 blast program will be the death of under 14's cricket. If kids play that bastardized game until 12 years of age, they will never play proper under 14's cricket for a local side. It's all well and good for Cricket Australia to crap on about how many kids they have in the game, but their own program is starting to erode actual junior cricketers. I know myself, I've lost kids from our milo program that would have gone to Mods (now non-competitive) to play T20 blast.

I would never run a T20 blast program at our club, the DVCA doesn't give you credit for a side and you're slitting your own throat when it comes to teenage cricketers.
How does the T20 blast program impact under 14's when it's a program designed for 7-10 yo. It's a fantastic program aimed at introducing kids to the game, goes for hour and a half and the kids love it. Along with the milo program and the modifieds it's an ideal lead in to Under 12 and competitive cricket. Our clubs number have grown significantly in last 3 years and hopefully it carries through to help retaining more juniors in time.
 

101% BULL

New Member
Only reason the run rate was no more than 1.5 over was because the ground was so slow!. Didn't have anything to do with players being nervous. Value for shots were non existent. Both sides bowled well which even made it harder to score.
There has been no shortage of big scores there this season, and Andrews bowled plenty of pies, batsman just weren't good enough and let the bowlers dictate.
 

_Blackhawk_

Active Member
How does the T20 blast program impact under 14's when it's a program designed for 7-10 yo. It's a fantastic program aimed at introducing kids to the game, goes for hour and a half and the kids love it. Along with the milo program and the modifieds it's an ideal lead in to Under 12 and competitive cricket. Our clubs number have grown significantly in last 3 years and hopefully it carries through to help retaining more juniors in time.
It's 8-12 years old. Has your actual clubs junior numbers grown, or has there just been a growth in the CA run programs (Milo and T20B)? There's a difference. Personally, I think it's a terrible lead in to junior cricket. I like the Mods program within the DVCA structure as it gives the kids a taste of the game while guaranteeing they get a bat and a bowl. The T20 blast program does nothing to prepare the kids for proper cricket, it's just designed to keep the kids on CA's books for a longer period of time so they can say "oh look, we're doing something to promote cricket to kids" while making clubs do most of the work and giving them precisely ************ all back. Actually, worse than ************ all, they are stripping kids away from being on club books. I know the kids we lost to T20 blast programs will never play cricket as an actual member of a local club.

If clubs keep sending their 8-12 year olds to the T20 blast program, under 14's will go the same way as Under 16's in this comp.
 

PIETHROWER

New Member
Were you there? He obviously was and he is saying that the batsman were not game to take the bowling on, suggesting that while his figures were tidy there were runs to be made..
Don't follow either side play in another comp,and was at Bundoora watching. Probably the reason the batsman didn't take him on was because he was consistently hitting a spot. They weren't prepared to use their feet and look to score. Credit to Andrews I say.
 

Artie Bucco

Active Member
Don't follow either side play in another comp,and was at Bundoora watching. Probably the reason the batsman didn't take him on was because he was consistently hitting a spot. They weren't prepared to use their feet and look to score. Credit to Andrews I say.
Yeah fair enough, I don't even know what he bowls, presumably spin? There has been a trend in this comp of what should be part time bowlers tying down an end because batsman aren't prepared to take a risk and get themselves in a rut. If you're looking to survive not score then every ball seems to hit the spot and one will have your name on it.
 
Don't follow either side play in another comp,and was at Bundoora watching. Probably the reason the batsman didn't take him on was because he was consistently hitting a spot. They weren't prepared to use their feet and look to score. Credit to Andrews I say.
If you play in a different comp why would all your comments be on a dvca forum,piss off out of here he bowles pies
 

PIETHROWER

New Member
If you play in a different comp why would all your comments be on a dvca forum,piss off out of here he bowles pies
Can't be interested and have an opinion?. Not a lot of positive words on here just a lot of bagging of blokes and clubs. Let's talk cricket instead of being ego minded cocksmokers!!.
 
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