rumourisfact
Member
correct, subbies is no different to any other suburban turf cricket 1st grade.. not sure why some have inflated opinions of it.. SUB meaning inferior to district cricket.. so on the same level as other suburban turf 1's?!
Subbies Thread
- Thread starter rang1
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Round the grounds
Active Member
You blokes should all go work for Trump
First time I've ever been associated with the thinkings of Trump
But thanks for addressing my question!!
five80
Active Member
Just the standard of cricket really. It's better than Premier 2's. I think you'd find of last year's 4 Grand Finalists there'd be 20 Premier 1's players involved. Just my opinion.
I played in the Subbies for 5 years and played about 40 1st XI games between the age of 15-19 before having a go at Premier Cricket and felt it was a great grounding for me personally. The grounds and wickets were generally quite good and you were competing weekly against guys who had played Premier 1s but were still in there mid-late 20s/early 30s. Many of my Subbie team mates suggested I would be be better doing this than going straight to Premier at 15/16 and most likely playing 3s against kids my own age.
The competition was always very well run and even now Ive noticed that it still produces the most amount of Premier debutants each season. All but 1-2 clubs have reasonable depth in the 1st XI.
In the twilight of my career I decided to play with some mates in the VTCA for a bit of fun and there were so many things that annoyed me. Poor pitches every couple of games, having to do square leg umpire in the 1s, sledging was embarrassing/non cricket related and even violent, teams not wearing correct uniform, silly playing conditions/rules and a lot of things you take for granted just didn't happen. For those reasons I'd prefer to play Subbies.
I know there's a heap of great cricketers out there in many leagues of different standard around the state but for the above reasons I'd prefer playing Subbies rather than guessing on a local comp.
The competition was always very well run and even now Ive noticed that it still produces the most amount of Premier debutants each season. All but 1-2 clubs have reasonable depth in the 1st XI.
In the twilight of my career I decided to play with some mates in the VTCA for a bit of fun and there were so many things that annoyed me. Poor pitches every couple of games, having to do square leg umpire in the 1s, sledging was embarrassing/non cricket related and even violent, teams not wearing correct uniform, silly playing conditions/rules and a lot of things you take for granted just didn't happen. For those reasons I'd prefer to play Subbies.
I know there's a heap of great cricketers out there in many leagues of different standard around the state but for the above reasons I'd prefer playing Subbies rather than guessing on a local comp.
Turf Cricket
Active Member
And how many were playing CSB and not having to travel !
Turf Cricket
Active Member
How long ago in the VTCA, because the last few years have been off.
five80
Active Member
No idea. 3?
Turf Cricket
Active Member
Plenty
What on earth prompted you get into a discussion on the relative merits of various competitions? You were on-song in your earlier posts in that you expressed the logical view that the competition that has most merit for a club is that which best suits its needs. In the case of my club (it not Sunshine C C) a combination of 2 competitions suits the needs of our open-age players.
It is the responsibility of the administration of each and every club to do what it considers is best for its players. Obviously, one size does not fit all.
I don't have a problem with any of that, although I can tell you the CSB has the vtca covered by a long way.
My issue is with the perception that the vsdca is superior when the reasons you say it is better are some of the great features of CSB. Unbelievable facilities, great standard, some quality players playing a terrific standard and some fantastic formats throughout the grades. And no travel
I was quoting others. Have never commented on the relative merits of other comps (apart from the vtca), merely responding to others saying the vsdca was superior. Just wanted to know why that perception was there
Round the grounds
Active Member
CSB has one great side, two OK sides (Bentleigh may not be now they have lost King and Tangy couldn't compete without Mueller) and the rest make up the numbers. Only Caulfield South would be a genuine flag chance in the Subbies format. In the finals this season, there was a tie between 1st and 6th, indicative of the depth of the comp. We get that you like CSB and you think it is better than Senior Div VTCA, but it's not a better standard of cricket. More than half the sides are uncompetitive over the course of the season. Give the travel a rest, it's just noise, because if a player has a problem with the travel aspect of Subbies (which is only 1st and 2nd XI) then they have plenty of other comps they can choose to play in but yet they keep coming and they stay. Maybe Hampton can look at a couple of practice matches against some Subbies clubs and that may help you with your perception.
Turf Cricket
Active Member
At least have the nous to call a club by it's correct name. Yes South Caulfield would be a flag chance, but once again would have to come up against the same clubs that dominate subbies year in year out. Your fighting a losing battle.
Round the grounds
Active Member
Melton, Malvern, and Oakleigh have won more flags in the last 10 years than Caulfield or PV. Just who is that dominates? Balwyn, Mt Waverley, Ormond, Noble Park, Box Hill, and Coburg have also won a flag in that period. Get off the Cheech and Chongs Turfie!
Young Willi Lad
Active Member
Absolutely, yes some sides make the finals year in and year out but there hasn't been a dominant premiership winning club since Melton going back 5-7 years.....
It is, I think, a curious irony that a principal reason for Sunshine remaining in the subbies for longer than was in its best interests was the very fact the subbies was, rightly, held in high regard and, any move to an alternative competition would be a step down in standards and prestige. And indeed it was--there was, for example, an instance where the home team deliberately sabotaged their pitch prior to the second day's play due to Sunshine having already gained first innings points, obviously with the aim of denying Sunshine an outright. Sunshine's protest was not thoroughly investigated by the VTCA --just brushed under the carpet would be a fair comment.
However, Sunshine has suffered damage by remaining in the subbies long after it became uncompetitive. Morale suffered and players departed. It can now only field 3 open-age teams. As a consequence, Council has forced it to share Lloyd Reserve. It cannot put pressure on players to train as they know they are likely to get a game without training. A week before the season's commencement no work had been done their pitch at Dempster. Enquiries by an elderly life member and me revealed the only expression of interest was from a curator residing at Rowville for goodness sake-- little wonder nothing had been done!!We prepared the pitches .This is just a brief summary of what has befallen a club who failed to face up to reality in a timely manner.
However, Sunshine has suffered damage by remaining in the subbies long after it became uncompetitive. Morale suffered and players departed. It can now only field 3 open-age teams. As a consequence, Council has forced it to share Lloyd Reserve. It cannot put pressure on players to train as they know they are likely to get a game without training. A week before the season's commencement no work had been done their pitch at Dempster. Enquiries by an elderly life member and me revealed the only expression of interest was from a curator residing at Rowville for goodness sake-- little wonder nothing had been done!!We prepared the pitches .This is just a brief summary of what has befallen a club who failed to face up to reality in a timely manner.
rumourisfact
Member
A good game of subbies 1's is just on par with premier 2's, I have played both so that is speaking from personal experience, middle of the road teams and lower teams are not at premier 2's standard at all.
Not at all knocking the standard of subbies but I just don't think it's as strong as it's built up to be.
I merely asked for reasons why people think Subbies is better – and a couple of people were good enough to respond. As I said before, I don’t really care – and have too much on my hands to get in a pi$$ing contest about who is better
If you want to cherry-pick examples though then your argument falls flat. To say a club wouldn’t be as strong without player X – that can apply in any comp, with any team. And South Caulfield – as you say - might be the only team who could win a subbies flag (although Bonbeach did beat them twice this year), but Hoppers weren’t exactly lighting up the VTCA, and Taylors Lakes weren’t even in the top division before coming across to the Subbies. But they are just cherry picked examples
And for what it’s worth, I’m pretty happy where we are going at Hampton. We are building from the bottom up, we will have 5-7 U18s play 1st XI this season, a similar amount play 2nds – and we have a couple of young guys playing Premier 1s at the minute.
Round the grounds
Active Member
TBH we have had that debate in the past I feel like the whole thing is becoming quite repetitive. In the end, it is a debate that hopefully won't ever be resolved so it all comes down to personal opinion. You have yours, I have mine, sometimes we agree, on this issue we don't. SBOCC, Hoppers and Taylors Lake aren't interesting because they didn't win VTCA Senior Div or Subbies flags. They are interesting because with all the cards on the table, they made the decision to switch comps and I think that says alot. South Caulfield didn't switch so I guess that says something too (although quite frankly I still don't understand why, big fish/little pond?). You should be extremely happy with how Hampton is going. I have never met you personally, and, at the risk of appearing to pi$$ in your pocket, which I am not, I have no doubt you are a good cricket person, the type all clubs need to succeed.