someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Yeah, as you say this sounds like good coaching and it sounds like the boys understand what the coach is trying to do. Shame if he's out of the game though with his blisters and the 12th man rule.
Wrist Spin Bowling (part Five)
- Thread starter Richard the Third
- Start date
Yeah, as you say this sounds like good coaching and it sounds like the boys understand what the coach is trying to do. Shame if he's out of the game though with his blisters and the 12th man rule.
macca
Active Member
Ended up playing but not doing much except winning the toss and getting a 4th ball duck and not bowling but his team won the grand final. That is huge for us because I didn't expect him to play in a champion team in any sport but he just has knack for legspin bowling which got him there
They looked like losing right up till the last 2 overs but just won by 4 runs.
Best thing we did was moving clubs last season but still we need to do a lot of off season work to keep a spot in this team. Especially fielding and batting.
Wrongun and flipper are going to get lot of practise this winter but we might give indoor comp a miss unless we both play in a team together. Indoor is good but it does stop him experimenting and spending a lot on the variations because you have to keep the legbreak in tune for the indoor comp.
Great news Macca, and whilst he may not have done too much today, I think when you both have a moment to look back on the season there will be many points where he has contributed to the success of the team and helped get them into the grand final.
Easy to say from half a world away, but I would have a word with the coach before dismissing the indoor season. If he needs to sharpen up his batting and fielding it may prove a welcome form of off season training and he could have all the tricks he wants with his bowling but if the pace attack is as strong as you have suggested earlier this season who would you rather have - an outstanding leggie who you can count on if the quicks fail or a pretty good leggie without all the variations but a player who is valuable to the team throughout the game? There isnt a right answer to this from either the club or players points of view although hopefully whatever the answer is it fits both parties. Congratulations again and whatever the answer, all the best for the off season
Congratulations, well you can tick this year as an extremely sucessful one for Jimmy. Well done
I would probably keep playing indoor for the batting and fielding and just to keep cricket fun. Thats my opinion anyway and bowling against batsman in game situations is good experience, especially as they will be slogging a lot and your bound to come across a few sloggers in outdoor cricket.
Things went badly for us today. We were rolled for 103. We had them at 2/0 then 3/10 then 4/30 but their two experienced batsman have pushed it up to 5/80 before the close of play. So we have to go back today and take those 5 wickets for 20 runs or get them all out soon after they pass us, go in and smash some quick runs and bowl them all out again for less than we get.
All in all a very tough task.
The pitch we were playing on though has to be the worst Ive ever seen. Its like a astroturf salesmans showroom with about 6 samples of carpet all layed in. And depending on where it hit it either took off round their ears or bounced one foot high. I came on first change and bowled about 80%. We were getting deperate by then so we had fielders all round the bat and I was trying to bowl short up into their ribs but just couldnt manage to get it right. So frustrating being injured!!!!
I was asking the captain to give me a go bowling leg spin but I think he has lost confidence in me after my last performance.
All in all a very tough task.
The pitch we were playing on though has to be the worst Ive ever seen. Its like a astroturf salesmans showroom with about 6 samples of carpet all layed in. And depending on where it hit it either took off round their ears or bounced one foot high. I came on first change and bowled about 80%. We were getting deperate by then so we had fielders all round the bat and I was trying to bowl short up into their ribs but just couldnt manage to get it right. So frustrating being injured!!!!
I was asking the captain to give me a go bowling leg spin but I think he has lost confidence in me after my last performance.
macca
Active Member
Bad luck mate. My sons team only just won, and they were the only team at our club in any grade to win a comp this season.
macca
Active Member
Probably will do indoor comp and for the reasons you mention. I notice all the kids who play indoor start their seasons better than most, and that can go for the first 6 games.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Tony I thought it was you that was in two minds as to whether you sould rest up completely in the off-season?
indoor is absolutely invaluable from a fielding perspective. my fielding will have come along massively due to playing indoor this winter. i cant wait to get outside. youre fielding a plastic ball that hurts more than a leather one when it hits you, from positions that would definitely be classed as "silly" outdoors (regardless of your position really), against batsmen that are looking to smash everything as hard and as straight as they physically can with zero fear of being dismissed. take that experience back outdoors to fielding positions 20 yards further from the bat than any indoor position, against a ball that hurts your hands a lot less, and it will be childs play!
i started the season thinking that indoor is good for leg spin, but the more it progresses, the more ive decided that for me it is completely unhelpful. it doesnt improve accuracy really because a good line and length outdoors isnt a good line or length indoors and get hit. erring on the full side results in sixes, dropping short equals singles and 3's. bowling negative leg stump lines from around the wicket and cramping the batsmen up on their pads results in singles. convert that outdoors and the good length balls are going for singles at best. the fuller ones probably the same. the shorter ones are going for 4's all day long, and the leg stump line to cramp the pads is easy singles and 2's with no chance of a wicket. it forces you to bowl the total opposite of what you want to do outdoors, and variations are fairly insignificant.
from a batting perspective, i also think it is quite counter productive. outdoors most of the shots that go for a 6 indoors wouldnt even be a single. most of the 4's would be caught. anything with enough elevation to clear the ropes tends to hit the roof for a single. the best sweeps, cuts, and wide drives (e.g. cover and mid wicket) go for singles, whereas outdoors they are the run scoring shots. you are often forced to play overly aggressive innings just to try and chase down huge totals (especially if you bat middle order like me), and if that mentality carries over to the outdoor season you will get out for a lot of single digit scores early on to weak dismissals. the one thing i think it does improve is your running. you have to take runs whenever you can get them, and fielders have a maximum of about 30 yards to throw the ball at the stumps, often less than 10 yards. so judging the runs is critical, and i think it trains you well for taking the quick singles outdoors. but thats the only thing about it that i see as being helpful.
im in 2 minds as to whether il play indoor next winter. i think this winter i would have been far better served spending those evenings in the gym working on my strength and fitness, and then saving the £30-40 a month in match fees and putting that towards an hour of indoor nets every 2-3 weeks.
i started the season thinking that indoor is good for leg spin, but the more it progresses, the more ive decided that for me it is completely unhelpful. it doesnt improve accuracy really because a good line and length outdoors isnt a good line or length indoors and get hit. erring on the full side results in sixes, dropping short equals singles and 3's. bowling negative leg stump lines from around the wicket and cramping the batsmen up on their pads results in singles. convert that outdoors and the good length balls are going for singles at best. the fuller ones probably the same. the shorter ones are going for 4's all day long, and the leg stump line to cramp the pads is easy singles and 2's with no chance of a wicket. it forces you to bowl the total opposite of what you want to do outdoors, and variations are fairly insignificant.
from a batting perspective, i also think it is quite counter productive. outdoors most of the shots that go for a 6 indoors wouldnt even be a single. most of the 4's would be caught. anything with enough elevation to clear the ropes tends to hit the roof for a single. the best sweeps, cuts, and wide drives (e.g. cover and mid wicket) go for singles, whereas outdoors they are the run scoring shots. you are often forced to play overly aggressive innings just to try and chase down huge totals (especially if you bat middle order like me), and if that mentality carries over to the outdoor season you will get out for a lot of single digit scores early on to weak dismissals. the one thing i think it does improve is your running. you have to take runs whenever you can get them, and fielders have a maximum of about 30 yards to throw the ball at the stumps, often less than 10 yards. so judging the runs is critical, and i think it trains you well for taking the quick singles outdoors. but thats the only thing about it that i see as being helpful.
im in 2 minds as to whether il play indoor next winter. i think this winter i would have been far better served spending those evenings in the gym working on my strength and fitness, and then saving the £30-40 a month in match fees and putting that towards an hour of indoor nets every 2-3 weeks.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Jim
(1) What plastic balls are you using that hurt less than a cricket ball..... Hockey balls?
(2) Since when have plastic balls assuming that can't possibly mean Hockey Balls surely hurt less than a Cricket Ball?
Dave, im saying that the indoor balls hurt more. did you misread that or mistype your reply? its not clear.
anyhow, we use 4.5oz plastic indoor balls, not sure how they compare to hockey balls. but trust me that they hurt more!! we have this discussion amongst ourselves at indoor games all the time, especially after one of us has worn one, but the only conclusion we can come to is that because the ball can deform more, when it hits you it spreads out and hits over a larger area and stings more. if you catch a leather ball thats been hit hard and flat cleanly in your hand then generally it doesnt really hurt that much, sometimes it might sting a bit if you dont cushion it. the plastic indoor balls just hurt every time, no matter how clean the take. they hurt through wicket keeper gloves!
it probably doesnt help that youre fielding from so close, but i could have had a dozen caught and bowled dismissals if i dared to put my hand out. against a leather ball i would have every time, against the indoor ball sometimes its just not worth the risk, i need my hands for my work.
anyhow, we use 4.5oz plastic indoor balls, not sure how they compare to hockey balls. but trust me that they hurt more!! we have this discussion amongst ourselves at indoor games all the time, especially after one of us has worn one, but the only conclusion we can come to is that because the ball can deform more, when it hits you it spreads out and hits over a larger area and stings more. if you catch a leather ball thats been hit hard and flat cleanly in your hand then generally it doesnt really hurt that much, sometimes it might sting a bit if you dont cushion it. the plastic indoor balls just hurt every time, no matter how clean the take. they hurt through wicket keeper gloves!
it probably doesnt help that youre fielding from so close, but i could have had a dozen caught and bowled dismissals if i dared to put my hand out. against a leather ball i would have every time, against the indoor ball sometimes its just not worth the risk, i need my hands for my work.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Sting is different to hurt, a plastic ball in the face is never going to hurt you, yeah smart/sting etc, but the likelyhood of anyone breaking bones with a plastic ball is minimal hence the reason kids use them. Anyday of the week I'd take a rubberised plastic ball to the shins, ribs, head in preference to a real cricket ball. Unless you're using high density solid plastic balls like the ones used in the Bola machines which I always thought were a little lighter?
http://www.cricketsupplies.com/product/2505/bola/5oz-practice-balls-dozen.htm these would still hurt in the same way that you're talking about, but they are only 5oz, so would be slightly less likely to hurt I suppose, but I thought you were talking about the rubberised training balls with seams on?
http://www.cricketsupplies.com/product/2505/bola/5oz-practice-balls-dozen.htm these would still hurt in the same way that you're talking about, but they are only 5oz, so would be slightly less likely to hurt I suppose, but I thought you were talking about the rubberised training balls with seams on?
no Dave they arent the kids balls (e.g. incrediballs), they are solid plastic!! proper hard like hockey balls, you take one in the face and youre in big trouble, as much so as with a leather cricket ball. harder than the bowling machine balls as well.
they are these... http://www.morrant.com/readers_cricket_balls/readers_indoor_cricket_ball/46722_p.html
"only" 4oz, but believe me, they hurt a lot!! more than leather balls, as said. cant wait to get back outdoors lol, the other thing with indoor is that the ball can ricochet off the walls, net ceiling (and go in any direction), overthrows from fielders can easily hit another fielder or the batsman, etc. its like a minefield. i sound like a proper wuss now, but im not really. i still field everything if i can.
they are these... http://www.morrant.com/readers_cricket_balls/readers_indoor_cricket_ball/46722_p.html
"only" 4oz, but believe me, they hurt a lot!! more than leather balls, as said. cant wait to get back outdoors lol, the other thing with indoor is that the ball can ricochet off the walls, net ceiling (and go in any direction), overthrows from fielders can easily hit another fielder or the batsman, etc. its like a minefield. i sound like a proper wuss now, but im not really. i still field everything if i can.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
I can believe that - yeah if they're solid like a Hockey ball, they're going to hurt, but at 4oz a direct hit in the shin/cheek bone at 60mph surely isn't going to be as bad as 5.5oz cricket ball? But then cricket ball with a cork innards may give? Whereas a solid plastic ball could be worse as it hasn't got any give, depsite being an ounce and a half lighter? So I stand corrected.
I always thought Hockey seemed like a lunatic game using those balls and those bloody sticks, they're obviously 'Rock hard' those bloke/girls that play that!
to be fair, if a cricket ball hits you on a bone its going to do damage as well. ive worn cricket balls on my ankles, feet, shins, thighs, ribs, and it bruises up nicely, but thats to be expected. the difference is that indoor balls bruise your hands when you take them cleanly though!! outdoor balls are just that little bit softer in that regard, and it doesnt help when youre fielding from 15-25 yards, whereas outdoors youd probably be 40 yards+ for the same position.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
Jim, what you bowling this season? Have you reduced the number of variations that you're using in a game and when should we expect to see how and what you're bowling this year up on Youtube? I'm still toying with the idea of buying the slo-mo camera, but still can't justify paying £129.00 for one, just so that I can post videos up on Youtube.
While I'm asking Jim, what does everyone else have in their bag of tricks this season? I'm primarily working with Leg Break variations e.g. one that'll turn more than the other. But I'm bowling more conventional Top-Spinners this year, as they're help with the subtleties in getting a small Leg Break that dips more and a small Wrong Un. I've scrapped the Big Wrong Un. I'm still toying with the Off-Spinning Flipper as that gives me a ball that's a lot faster and it drifts and it pretty accurate.
While I'm asking Jim, what does everyone else have in their bag of tricks this season? I'm primarily working with Leg Break variations e.g. one that'll turn more than the other. But I'm bowling more conventional Top-Spinners this year, as they're help with the subtleties in getting a small Leg Break that dips more and a small Wrong Un. I've scrapped the Big Wrong Un. I'm still toying with the Off-Spinning Flipper as that gives me a ball that's a lot faster and it drifts and it pretty accurate.
Well we lost the semi final on Sunday. After getting only 103 they passed us and were all out for 160. We batted again and got a quick 140 before declaring, giving us a lead of 80 odd with 23 overs to bowl them out in. Unfortunately they got them without losing a wicket although it was a bit of fun at the end with everyone getting a bowl.
So ends my fast bowling career. I ended up with 2 wickets bowling at half pace and got 37 wickets from 15 games for the season. Not a bad effort I reckon but after hobbling off the field with a bad knee and sore stomach I can say Im not really going to miss the hard toil it requires. I managed to hit a bloke in the ribs with a short ball which satisfyied my nasty fast bowling streak for the last time too.
So ends my fast bowling career. I ended up with 2 wickets bowling at half pace and got 37 wickets from 15 games for the season. Not a bad effort I reckon but after hobbling off the field with a bad knee and sore stomach I can say Im not really going to miss the hard toil it requires. I managed to hit a bloke in the ribs with a short ball which satisfyied my nasty fast bowling streak for the last time too.
someblokecalleddave
Well-Known Member
You'll have to look at your figures and work out all your average and strike rate, it'll be interesting to compare them with your wrist spinning next year. So, what now, will you rest up for a while and do you do anything in the closed season (Aussie football, baseball) or will you keep at it and will the weather allow you to do so? As I recall a surfing mate of mine from Sydney said it avearges 10 or 11 degrees throughout the depths of your winter and gets a bit cloudy and grey a lot of the time, kind of an okay winter day here in the UK. What's with the knee - is that bad, or just a one off from the match? Hopefully it'll be your right knee and not your left? My right knees bad and I'm a bit worried about it in the longer term, I reckon my sprinting and out-running 17 year old days are over, I'll have to see how it goes. Hope yours isn't too bad.
luckydip
New Member
Macca, good to hear from you. Congrats to Jimmy on the win, what happened to the star batsman the other team had?
macca
Active Member
He got out to a great catch after batting for a fair while but not scoring that many runs, about 30 or so but the pressure got to him I reckon, because his team depended so much on him he virtually had to bat the whole innings if they wanted to win, he spent ages digging in and looked well set but when he got out you could see the panic run through his team mates.
i have not checked his final batting stats for the season but he was the leading u/13 batsman on the weet bix stats website ladder in the whole country after 3 rounds! But he came back to the pack after a few more rounds but probably heads the batting averages for the comp but some of our teams batsmen would be close to his numbers