Leg Spin Video Analysis

[Liz Ward]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

There is a lot that can be done with regard to your shoulder but it is a hands on thing so you would need to see somebody who could release your supraspinatus for you. Apologies if I have missed all the info on this but how did you come to suffer this impingement?

As for the technical side of things, you are not going to be able to improve without release and I am not too sure the extra compensatory flexion is really going to do you good in the long run. This is also going to interfere with any attempt at a full follow through.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

There is a lot that can be done with regard to your shoulder but it is a hands on thing so you would need to see somebody who could release your supraspinatus for you. Apologies if I have missed all the info on this but how did you come to suffer this impingement?

As for the technical side of things, you are not going to be able to improve without release and I am not too sure the extra compensatory flexion is really going to do you good in the long run. This is also going to interfere with any attempt at a full follow through.

My supraspina-what-us? I don't have the faintest idea how this came about. I've only been bowling again for the last four months, but when I was twelve I used to bowl around my shoulder in pretty much the same way, only back then I wasn't trying to spin it. Perhaps this is how come I get so many issues with sore shoulders. It simply feels impossible to roll my arm over my shoulder rather than round it.

 

[rorymathews]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

i think when you bowl you need to just focus staying tall. the round arm then isn't a problem as long as it isnt too far down. just try it from standing still then gradually build up to it.

 

[macca]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

Here's a video of my action bowling in the garden last week: YouTube - (more) bowling practice (previous video from a few months ago is here for reference: YouTube - Bowling practice)

Comments please!

I dont like mucking around with actions too much especially if you are in season. Just work on improving the things you already do.



As an exercise see if you can reach the beginning of your delivery and plant the right foot parallel to the bowling crease and then stop and try and balance yourself so you are standing with your right foot down and left leg up and bent at the knee. You should be able to hold that pose and not collapse forward. You might have to rock back a bit more and lift your left leg higher at that point to achieve that balance.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

i think when you bowl you need to just focus staying tall. the round arm then isn't a problem as long as it isnt too far down. just try it from standing still then gradually build up to it.

My problem is that my arm seems literally incapable of swinging round above my shoulder, so the taller I stand, the more round-arm I become, and then my accuracy evaporates.

 

[macca]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

. just try it from standing still then gradually build up to it.

The blancing on the right leg and lifting the left leg from the exercise I described before is good to practise standing still as well as with a run up.

 

[rorymathews]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

My problem is that my arm seems literally incapable of swinging round above my shoulder, so the taller I stand, the more round-arm I become, and then my accuracy evaporates.

Oh man, have you tried getting physio for this? It may help to imrove your bowling

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

My supraspina-what-us?

...from How to protect your shoulder from cricket injury | Cricket coaching, fitness and tips

oooh! Not sure that illustration needs to be so big

Take Rory's advice.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

So would you say that this is quite definitely a temporary problem with my shoulder? Because as far as I can remember it's always been like this. I do know a very well-qualified physio, so I'll have a word with her about it.

I do like the name though: "musculus supraspinatus" sounds like something Harry Potter would cry as he let rip with a vicious big leg break...

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

Yeah the physio visit I reckon is a key aspect to you going forward with your bowling. Get someone to look at your shoulder and whatever the outcome is that'll be your starting point.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

Without being able to see you and having a little palpation, I cannot say definitely. There are one or two tests I would like to do to be certain but from what you say, it does sound like an impingement. The physio will be able to say for sure and she will be able to get the muscles firing correctly, which would allow your arm to 'swing' high. This is not something that will correct itself.

You should be able to stand straight with your arm against your body, palm facing your hip. Raise your [straight] arm away to the side and then up so that the palm is facing away from the body, the arm should be vertical, without flexing at the waist. Can you do this?

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

You should be able to stand straight with your arm against your body, palm facing your hip. Raise your [straight] arm away to the side and then up so that the palm is facing away from the body, the arm should be vertical, without flexing at the waist. Can you do this?

Yes, I can.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

From that position, can you lower the arm directly infront of you, palm facing forward. When your hand reaches the bottom, rotate so your palm is still facing forward and bring the arm straight back, behind you until it reaches up vertical again... without bending your body?

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

From that position, can you lower the arm directly infront of you, palm facing forward. When your hand reaches the bottom, rotate so your palm is still facing forward and bring the arm straight back, behind you until it reaches up vertical again... without bending your body?

If what you're asking me to do is bring the arm straight back up past the waist palm-forward without rotating my hand as I move my arm round, then I can't do that. When it gets to about 30 degrees behind me it sort of gets stuck. I have to move my arm out sideways a bit to turn all the way round, but I'm not sure whether this is normal or whether the arm should go straight round in a flat disc.

 

[someblokecalleddave]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

From that position, can you lower the arm directly infront of you, palm facing forward. When your hand reaches the bottom, rotate so your palm is still facing forward and bring the arm straight back, behind you until it reaches up vertical again... without bending your body?

I don't think I can do this either. As my arm comes down from the vertical poistion and goes past my hip, once it's past the hip it has to move off its circular line and away from my body by about 30-40 degrees and then comes back towards the vertical position as it comes back to the vertical again. In order to keep the arm going through the same vertical plane I'd have to move my body to compensate? Or am I confusing things here by butting in?

 

[rorymathews]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

not being able to move your arm in a perfect circle is normal i think. i just depends on shoulder and side muscle flexibility how straight you can get it.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

I don't think I can do this either. As my arm comes down from the vertical poistion and goes past my hip, once it's past the hip it has to move off its circular line and away from my body by about 30-40 degrees and then comes back towards the vertical position as it comes back to the vertical again. In order to keep the arm going through the same vertical plane I'd have to move my body to compensate? Or am I confusing things here by butting in?

Yeah, sound to me as if that's normal, although Liz is the expert so I'll wait to hear what she says.

I had a little go in the garden trying to swing my arm right round, and I can just about do it, BUT:
1. it feels totally unnatural
2. the ball seems to come out far to fast to get any spin on it
3. I lose all control of line, length and spin
4. it hurts more than round-arm
5. having to think about it distracts me form everything else I'm trying to do during a delivery
6. to bowl like this properly would probably mean developing a completely new action from scratch, right from run-up to follow through.

The main difference is in the section between the gather and where my arm is horizontally behind my shoulder. My natural action is to pull or "place" my hand behind me and pull it back forward, like stretching a rubber band and releasing it I suppose, where as to go right round I have to actually pull my arm down and back up and then let the momentum swing it round the top. I'm not a fan, it has to be said.

 

[rorymathews]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

pulling it back and then jerking it back in the delivery would put a lot of strain on the shoulder. i think you would be able to keep your run up the same but i think a follow through was where your action was lacking previously as well as staying tall. keep persevering and hopefully you will reap the rewards.

 

[Liz Ward]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

If what you're asking me to do is bring the arm straight back up past the waist palm-forward without rotating my hand as I move my arm round, then I can't do that. When it gets to about 30 degrees behind me it sort of gets stuck. I have to move my arm out sideways a bit to turn all the way round, but I'm not sure whether this is normal or whether the arm should go straight round in a flat disc.

No worries, that's fine. It does sound normal... but that [probably] is not what you want to hear . It means there is no reason why your 'arm seems literally incapable of swinging round above my shoulder'. However, it does mean you have something to work towards. Rather than an issue with your rotator cuff, they just appear to be a tad weak.

You should work to change your action, both to prevent injury and increase success, but now is really not the time to do it. Once the season starts, you really should not be messing around with action. The best thing to do is wait until the season closes [unless you want to give this one a miss] and get hold of a good coach. You should not need many sessions; possibly a couple, but you will need to work a lot on your own.

In the meantime, try to strengthen the RC. The exercises in my link should be enough and as Rory says, try to complete your follow through.

 

[Spiderlounge]

Re: Leg Spin Video Analysis

No worries, that's fine. It does sound normal... but that [probably] is not what you want to hear . It means there is no reason why your 'arm seems literally incapable of swinging round above my shoulder'. However, it does mean you have something to work towards. Rather than an issue with your rotator cuff, they just appear to be a tad weak.

You should work to change your action, both to prevent injury and increase success, but now is really not the time to do it. Once the season starts, you really should not be messing around with action. The best thing to do is wait until the season closes [unless you want to give this one a miss] and get hold of a good coach. You should not need many sessions; possibly a couple, but you will need to work a lot on your own.

In the meantime, try to strengthen the RC. The exercises in my link should be enough and as Rory says, try to complete your follow through.

Thanks for the feedback Liz. If I have to change my action I'm of the opinion that I might as well start straight away and forego bowling in matches until I'm ready, otherwise I'm liable to get stuck in a bad habit and as a beginner I'd rather avoid that. Both the physios I've been to now have said the same thing: my bad posture over many years has left my back muscles overstretched and my chest muscles too short. Could that have some bearing on it?